Talk:Coruscant/Archive2

Population
Reading this article, should check the sources but according to this - Coruscant had less then a trillion. (Other pages/articles aren't sources but if the sources listed are correct then it might be that Coruscant has a fairly small population for it's industrialization) http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Metellos

Just one trillion?
Coruscant has a surface area of about 470.65 million sqkm. Having said that, the average population density of the planet is 2124.72 inhabitants per sqkm. That is even less, than the average density of the City of Los Angeles. So where are all those fancy mile high sky scrapers, we see in the movies. I think a more adequate population count for that planet would be 100 trillion or even a quadrillion. And that's just plain mathematics.

216.228.176.248 09:45, 13 September 2008 (UTC)One can guess that, as on Earth, that there are many areas that are industrial or commercial that would be low density, mainly given over to heavy machinery. Also, areas like The Works appear to be mostly abandoned. Just as areas like Watts of LA are partially abandoned (never rebuilt after the race riots of the 60s), and many of our core city areas have been abandoned and given up to the criminal element (due to the fallacies of urban renewal and the insistence of the EPA that anyone buying the land must pay to clean up the environmental sins of the previous owners), there are likely many districts of Coruscant that are empty. - Nabuquduriuzhur

Some simple math shows that these numbers are off by a factor of 20. Star Wars is Space Opera, not Science Fiction. Numbers are chosen because they sound sufficiently impressive at first blush. On the other hand, there have historically been different measures of what a "billion" and a "trillion" are (a little study of Weimar Germany will reveal that), so one could suggest that they are far larger scales of measure than we use. More analysis on my userpage, as algebra is too theoretical for a talk page. --Sctn2labor 14:02, 18 October 2008 (UTC)

If you use the population density of New York City as a starting point, then spread it over the entire surface of Coruscant, you get about 5 trillion people. However, large areas of Coruscant such as the Works and the polar ice caps are uninhabited, which would tend to reduce the population count significantly to perhaps 3 trillion. This is consistent with the planetary census of 1 trillion being estimated at 1/3 of the true population. However, this assumes that Coruscant is only as densely populated as New York City, which would mean an average skyscraper height of just 30-50 stories, instead of the 300+ espoused in the movies. Taking this higher height into account, the true population of Coruscant would be estimated as approximately 25 trillion people, of which 8 trillion would be counted in a census. Thus, unless there is some reason for Coruscant to be very lightly populated (lots of rich people buy big penthouses, lower levels are not densely packed, etc), it makes the most sense for Coruscant to have a population approximately 8 times higher than that portrayed in EU sources - 25 Trillion. 75.189.132.215 13:26, July 1, 2010 (UTC)

[No title]
I find the scene from ROTJ Special Edition of the celebration on Coruscant odd. I can only think that the fireworks and celebration was amongst those who opposed the Emperor, but I imagine that their open defiance on Coruscant would have been met with swift retribution by the still in-power Imperial forces. --SparqMan 14:14, 5 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * Maybe they felt that the Imperials would be morally destroyed along with the Emperor. And maybe they were dealt with. -- Riffsyphon1024 14:25, 5 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * They were. Isard promptly ordered their executions (Mara Jade: By the Emperor's Hand).  Nonetheless, it was an important milestone - an anti-Imperial protest at the very heart of the Empire.  You wouldn't have seen any such thing if the Emperor hadn't died.  jSarek 21:28, 5 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * Yay, now I can think of their happy fates every time watch the ending to Return of the Jedi (or maybe I can just pretend the Special Edition never added it in) -lalala_la
 * Ah, excellent. I haven't read that comic, but I'm glad it was covered in continuity. --SparqMan 01:35, 6 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * Its also mentioned in one of the X-Wing novels (Wraith Squadron?). A few minutes after that scene the Stormtroopers were sent in...
 * Iron Fist, actually. The Stormtroopers just went in and started shooting. SFH 14:21, 29 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Main Image
How about this as the new Main File:

{removed due to abuse filter}/img157/9752/coruscantzj0.jpg

I think the present one is a bit blurry/raw, but I dunno, what do you think? --Sauron18 23:43, 27 July 2006 (UTC)
 * So, unless anyone doesn't want to, I'll be changing it in a bit :)--Sauron18 07:18, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

Actually, I think the last one was more colorful - this new pic seemes really bleak and depressing, so I think we should revert it back to the last picture.


 * Can we please?--Herbsewell 19:29, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
 * There was a very pretty one a while back (before it was replaced by the "sketchy" one). But it could have been a fanon piece or something.  Otherwise, it definitely should be the picture over the current, uglier one.  Exp.Fl.Cmndr. Mitth&#39;raw&#39;nuruodo 15:15, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

Coruscant citizens rejoicing after the death of the Emporer
In the 1997 Special Edition version of RotJ, the citizens of Coruscant rejoice after the Battle of Endor. I doubt they would dare. Just because the Emporer died and the Imperial fleet fled does not mean that Coruscant would be captured.

In fact, I think the scene directly conflicts with events from the X-Wing series.--Will 07:37, 18 August 2006 (UTC)
 * It's reconciled - it's a small scale revolt put down by Isard. It's mentioned in the article. QuentinGeorge 07:45, 18 August 2006 (UTC)

It did not look that "small" on screen. In fact, it looked to be planet-wide.Will 08:38, 18 August 2006 (UTC)
 * It didn't look planet-wide. You only see a small part of the planet. It, looked pretty big, but Coruscant is a big place. -LtNOWIS 09:20, 18 August 2006 (UTC)

With big fireworks shows and fighters overhead? Sounds more like a planned show.
 * That was only the Senate District that was shown in rejoice. The other areas like the Works may not have cared. -- Riffsyphon1024 04:49, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

Coruscant suns
If you look at the image of people partying after palpatine's death from ROTJ. You can see 2 suns. Does coruscant have 2 suns?
 * No, Coruscant only has one sun, as confirmed by Coruscant and the Core Worlds. -- Riffsyphon1024 04:50, 21 August 2006 (UTC)
 * Additionally, that shot is during the night hours, so those multiple objects are moons or fireworks. -- Riffsyphon1024 07:13, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
 * Coruscant has too moons, that's what those are Jondon Cenobi 03:40, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Actually, it has 4. -- Darth Phonebook  01:14, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
 * At least before the Yuuzhan Vong destroyed the smallest, Hesperidium. Though if the entire New Jedi Order, and all books following it (chronologically) were to be declared non-canon, that would be a great change (Chewbacca, Mon Mothma, Ackbar, Borsk Fey'lya, Anakin Solo alive; Yavin 4 and especially Coruscant in their "normal" states, and Ithor still around, etc.; respectable Jedi; a Republic and not a "Galactic Alliance;" etc.).  Exp.Fl.Cmndr. Mitth&#39;raw&#39;nuruodo 15:09, 21 January 2007 (UTC)
 * God the Vong suck... though it was gold for the writers when Chewbacca died, so many interesting things to write about--Jondon Cenobi 05:33, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

"Coruscant did not naturally have a climate suitable for Humans"
If Coruscant is the human homeworld, how can it not be suited for them? Thanos6 12:07, 16 September 2006 (UTC) Did'nt Coruscant have a Weather Damper System to make the City Areas Warmer?
 * It is not the homeworld, in any case the planet is a city, its been changed by species to suit them if you read the full part of that sentence orbital mirrors were used to heat the planet up.Jedi Dude 12:09, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
 * I did, and if you read the first section of the History section, or the NEC, it mentions Coruscant as the probable homeworld. Thanos6 12:25, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes i have, and probable means nothing, its speculation so doesn't really count tbh. Jedi Dude 13:14, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
 * It obviously is not mere speculation. Otherwise it would have already been deleted.  And while on the topic, what are the other candidates for the human homeworld (there are supposed to be 5)?  Exp.Fl.Cmndr. Mitth&#39;raw&#39;nuruodo 15:09, 21 January 2007 (UTC)
 * 1) 24.215.174.33
 * You mean cooler. With "Greenhouse lighting, hydroponic reticulation, gas exchange, plus the actual energy consumption of the civilization, that's at least 10^18 watts of waste heat. The surface should be hotter than boiling water, and nearly hot enough to melt lead." Quote from Irregular Webcomic!--Herbsewell 13:51, 29 December 2006 (UTC)


 * 10^18W is not that much for a whole planet. The energy consumed on earty is about 10^17 Wh in one year. One year has 365*24 hours, which is a little less than 10000. So energy consumption of the earth is about 10^13W on avarage. All this energy becomes waste heat at the end. The population of the earth is only about 12 per km², the population of coruscant should be a few billion per km² (see my comment in the food-section below). So 10^18W would be very low for Corouscant, the energy consumption per inhabitant would be 10^4*10^(-9)=10^(-5) times lower than on earth. If the production of energy per inhabitant would be the same as on earth, the total amount would be about 10^23 W. Because a more advanced society should consume rather more energy (and heat) per inhabitant, I think it would be rather 10^24 W or even more. And this should really be too much, if you dont cool the planet. -80.108.234.164 03:54, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Um that's 526,565,076,466,464 to 1,895,634,275,279,270,400 °C--Herbsewell 16:14, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I made a small error before (Mya IP was 80.108.234.164 at that time), the population is a few millions per km² (which you can also read in the food section), not a few billions, but this only makes the power consumption 10^3 lower, so you will still need at least 10^20 W or rather 10^21 W or more and still need cooling. However, I don't know, how you calculated the temperature w/o cooling, it is not very easy to calculate this, vbecause it is at thermodynamic equilibrium, and you must consider factors like albedo and greenhouse effect, but even w/o greenhouse effect and a very highAlbedo like 0.9 (=90%), the temperatures would still get much too high for humans. --62.178.241.80 02:09, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

An Ecumenopolis by 100,000BBY?
How could Coruscant have been an ecumenopolis from 100,000 BBY onward? They didn't even have superluminal travel until the Infinite Empire came in 30,000BBY---how did they feed a an entire planet covered in cities for 70,000 years? Did they grow food elsewhere inside the star system?
 * Was it covered in cities back then? If they were then it's ludicrous and impossible.  Now that the entire planet is one city, it would be impossible to transport enough food for the entire populous.--Herbsewell 01:42, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
 * You might want to take up to the IRC.--Herbsewell 01:44, 3 January 2007 (UTC)


 * There could have been some generation ship colonization, but you bring up a point. Unless they were capable of turning Coruscant into a sort of arcology, or get food, resources from other parts of their star system, or had a HUGE new agricultural revolution, it would seem to be difficult.  Then there is also the oxygen and  carbon dioxide and water to consider.  Exp.Fl.Cmndr. Mitth&#39;raw&#39;nuruodo 15:09, 21 January 2007 (UTC)
 * In Kotor 2 it says that the Rakatan took credit for the invention of the hyperdrive though they didn't invent it18:47, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

Food?
Where do they get their food?--Herbsewell 13:35, 16 December 2006 (UTC)
 * I believe much of it is shipped from off planet. I'm sure there were a few buildings out of that cityscape that at least had some food processing areas (greenhouses, indoor animal nursuries, farms, etc.). Jorrel Fraajic 15:05, 18 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Just becuse it's all city doesn't meen there can be no plants. Indoor agriculture woud be idela espcil;ay with so much space there coudl be masive farmlands all insid eone buuilding. If about 25% of ewrth is farmland 9random number) than 255 of coruscant bulidgs woukld produce food.
 * Well I mean since the idea of Coruscant is impractical it doesn't really matter. There's no way they could get enough food.--Herbsewell 20:47, 18 December 2006 (UTC)
 * You have a point in the impracticallity (the concept of a planet without plants is utterly horrifying to me) but you may also be forgetting just how large the Galaxy is, and how many planets are devoted to agricultural needs. -- SFH 20:49, 18 December 2006 (UTC)
 * No, it's just how many transports you would need. Food just isn't the only thing that makes the planet impossible--Herbsewell 21:02, 18 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Well, I suppose one would need a large fleet, and there are preservability issues as well...Lets just agree that its a fictional universe where somethings are politely left out. -- SFH 21:04, 18 December 2006 (UTC)
 * According to this calculation, it would be no problem to deliver enough food to corouscant, even with the highes estimates of the popultaion (10^15-10^16 people ), which would be also the most realistic in my point of view, because than the population density would be in the range of about 1-20 billion people per km², or 1-20 per m² (the diameter of corouscant is between ~12000 and ~18000 km, depending on the source). This is a realistic value in a city, where the buildings are 2 miles high from the ground (which would be about 1000 storeys). You must also consider, that not all the surface is used for buildings an not all buildings are used for apartments).


 * I think, the calculation on theforce.net is based on 6.5*10^14. Even if you consider this, there would be less then 1/1000 of the sky covered, for 10^16 people and 1.5 km ships, when all ships arrive at the same time of the day. -80.108.234.164 03:40, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * That's still a million freaking ships. Every day, back to back.  The cost of fuel, crews, maintenance, and ships themselves would be astronomical.  The whole world would go bankrupt.--Herbsewell 03:47, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I think space travel is much cheaper in the star wars universe than in reality. And the transportation of food will be even cheaper, especially if you use big ships like the 1.5 km or 15km squares, that where used in the excample on theforce.net. And it actually gets chepear (because more efficient), if you have more to deliver. What is important is not the total cost, but the cost, which is needed for 1 to get his food. In reality, the transportation costs are paid by the consumer, because it is included in the price. An I think, that w/ such big ships and hyperspace, the price can be kept in an affordable range, even if the food is shipped from everywhere in the empire.
 * Your attidude would be like a man's attidude to shipping food over tousends of miles was 200 years ago. 200 years ago, it would have been much too expensive an the food would be rotten long before arrival, but today they do it all the time and I know, that the avarage costs for shipping food is only about 1-2% of the price. -80.108.234.164 04:10, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Well we're talking a few Death Stars worth of ships. Oh, and get Firefox 2.0, it has a spell check.--Herbsewell 04:14, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I am not from an English speaking country, which is the reason why I make more spelling errors than other people when I write in English.-216.224.121.143 04:18, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Native Anglophones make plenty of typos, too. Exp.Fl.Cmndr. Mitth&#39;raw&#39;nuruodo 15:09, 21 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Btw, 1 deathstar is at least 120km in diameter. In the worts case (pop. 10^16) we would need about 15 ships w/ 15 km square, which is much less in volume than 1 deathstar w/ 120km diameter.
 * No, I'm pretty sure you would need more.--Herbsewell 04:26, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * The figures ar based on the calculations from theforce.net, not from me, but normalley they have quite good figures. And even if they ships w/ the toital size of a few deathstars every day: I think, 10^16 people would be enough to finance this. Also a frighter is much cheaper than a combat ship w/ the same size, because it doesnt need very strong weapons, most of the volume of these ship would be empty space to store things. -80.108.234.164 04:33, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Oh well then I guess it's okay. But in reality, it would have much, more people.--Herbsewell 04:35, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Also Saxton isn't computing the fact that Coruscant had thousand of layers. That alone would multiply the amount of ships by a hundredfold.--Herbsewell 14:19, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Saxton used just the figures from a canon source for his population. I made a realistic estimate (a few people per m², which is realistic: in a building w/ 1000 storeys, the population is i.e. 20 per m², when every citizen occupies 50 m² and not all of the surface is covered w/ buildings, that contain nothing but apartments, I think something like 25% would be more realistic). This leads to a population which is 1.5-15 times higher than saxton, and I multiplied his results w/ this factor. Actually he doesnt really mention,w hich populatrion he used for the calculation, but after reading his comments I think, that he most likely used the 650 billion w/ the european definition of billion, which is 10^12 (instead of the american 10^9). This leads to a total population of 6.5*10^14, I used 10^15-10^16, so the exact factor would be 1.538... to 15.38... -80.108.234.164 20:17, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * You would need about 80,000 Executor-class Star Dreadnoughts.--Herbsewell 20:47, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Yinchorri Uprising
The Yinchorri Uprising should be mentioned in this article! ! Raid on the Jedi Temple (Yinchorri Uprising) !
 * Well, that was an attack on the Jedi Temple itself, not Coruscant as a whole. Jorrel Fraajic 15:50, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Theme Music
Can anyone confirm that the 'Coruscant' theme in the films is not in fact by Williams, and is from another source (in this case, the Shadows of the Empire soundtrack)? It just seems false to me, however I cannot confirm or deny it as I don't have the Shadows of the Empire soundtrack. Melda 16:09, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Jedi temple?

 * In ROTJ, you can clearly see the Jedi Temple... Wasn't it destroyed in the great Jedi Purge? besides, would'nt Palpatine want it destroyed, to leave no trace of the jedi? Wasn't it burned anyway in Ep3? I'm confused... Pizza the Hutt 18:47, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Also, Palpatine would probably keep it to show what happens to Traitors of the Empire.--Herbsewell 18:50, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Read Dark Lord: The Rise of Darth Vader. It gives a good reason why he would keep it. Sidious had sent him here on a mission, ostensibly to search the archives for certain Sith holocrons long rumored to have been brought to the Temple centuries earlier.

Locations section?
Perhaps we should include a list of locales common and not-so-common to Coruscant. For example, start a list and put in Senate grounds, Jedi Temple, 500 Republica, etc. under one title, then another title for museums, etc. Commander Jorrel Fraajic  Communications Relay  19:59, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

Origins of the Name
The Adjective of Coruscant (and Coruscanti) and Origins of the name Coruscant sections are going to be removed. Coruscant comes from coruscate (see the Zahn quote just below the section), and many languages--including English--use such a suffix for nationality and adjectives (i.e. Israeli, Mitanni). Exp.Fl.Cmndr. Mitth&#39;raw&#39;nuruodo 12:26, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

Template testing
I found/created a new template for timelines and found it might be used for history sections on various articles. This one is Coruscant specific but hopefully, someone could help make one that can be interchangable with different parameters. This may actually work better with spans of time instead of events, like different eras. --  Riffsyphon  1024 07:07, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Hmm... I like it, except that it seems it would take up a lot of space... maybe make the template horizontal? 13:47, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Perhaps. The main problem is the lack of parameter editing and one has to make a completely new template, so I'm hoping for an update that will work or something else. --  Riffsyphon  1024 03:48, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Jedi Outcast
Star Wars: Jedi Knight: Jedi Outcast''

The planets of Jedi Outcast are : Kejim Artus Yavin Nar Shaddaa Bespin Cairn

No Coruscant, so I delete
 * The cutscene with Mon Mothma is on Coruscant. --  I need a name  ( Complain here ) 19:51, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

Main Image 2
What do you guys think of this image being in the top of the article? I chose that one because it was the "most recent" picture of Coruscant until now.



What do you think?  Stake black   msg 20:15, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
 * No way in hell. We don't go with the most recent if it has appeared in one of the films since the "live action shots" look a hell of a lot better then an artist rendition. -- Redemption Redemptionusersymbol.png Talk 20:25, 24 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Right. Just thought I would ask, because the current image is NOT a good one either  Stake black   msg 17:57, 25 March 2007 (UTC)

A Minor Point
I'm not sure where it was quoted from,but there can be only four quadrants there can be as many sectors as one would like or need or want,but there can be only four quadrants.Sochwa 23:37, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Hesperidium Not a Confirmed Moon of Coruscant?
Is there any actual confirmation anywhere that Hesperidium is a moon of Coruscant specifically?

From TastyTaste @ http://forums.starwars.com/thread.jspa?messageID=16683797&#16683797 :

''My understanding has always been that Hesperidium is a moon in the Coruscant system, but not of the planet Coruscant itself. I don't believe we've ever determined which planet.''

"The moon" of Coruscant
In Before the Storm, published before the full development of the Coruscant system, Han Solo is riding a speeder to Luke's retreat on Coruscant. As the speeder is taken control of by Luke's force powers, Han notices that "the moon was still well below the horizon". Which moon (Centax-1, 2, or 3) would this be? I would speculate that it was the closer Centax-1 if it is treated as a primary moon, like on Earth. --  Riffsyphon  1024 03:48, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

The three moons of Coruscant
In The Phantom Menace, three moons of Coruscant can be seen. Which moons would they be? They could be either Centax-1, Centax-2, Centax-3, Hesperidium or the destroyed Coruscant moon. Imperators II 13:43, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

Marvel comics appearance
In Marvel's Star Wars 63, Luke watches a video record of Shira Brie's life. One panel refers to her growing up in the palace of Palpatine as part of an indoctrination program. The picture that goes along with the text is just a courtyard in front of a Roman-looking building, but I think it could technically be considered the first-ever appearance of Coruscant. Should this be added into the Appearances? --JMM 13:22, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

Coruscant: who controls it now?
I'm a bit confused as to who has control over the planet as of the last "official" source. I don't think the article discusses this in clear detail nor does it mention the state of affairs in prominent structures as the old Jedi Temple, the Senate, etc. Can someone please devote perhaps a section in explaining the current state of Coruscant in greater detail that fans and merely interested individuals could easily understand? I think this would be a great way to summarize the current affairs of Coruscant so as to not leave the reader confused. Thank you. TrueJedi 13:07, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Look at the Table of Contents. See how the History section is divided into 8 sub-sections? Well, the last is 2.8, "New Galactic Empire. If that's not clear enough, and I can see how it might not be, Coruscant is "currently" under the control of Krayt's faction of the New Galactic Empire. -LtNOWIS


 * LtNOWIS, thank you for your response. I did take note of that section and you're right that it is somewhat confusing, especially since the section right below it states, "It is unknown as to whether the Galactic Alliance incorporated these same defenses during the rebuilding of Coruscant." So it kind of talks about the Galactic Alliance rebuilding yet doesn't mention what exactly the NGE is doing about the rebuilding of Coruscant. I think the section in question needs expansion so that control and governing of the planet is explained in a bit greater detail. Are there any thoughts as to have to enhance this section? Thank you again for the response. 68.93.105.182 13:56, 11 November 2007 (UTC)

Economic Rivalries
Shouldn't Anaxes and Alsakan be included in the section of "Economic Rivalries and Off-Planet Political Centers"? I'm not particularly familiar with either, but both seem to fit the bill as rival powers that struggled with Coruscant for galactic dominance.

Water on Coruscant...
I have a question about the water under Coruscant. In the Last of the Jedi children's books, wasn't Solace living in a cave in the lowest levels of the planet, and their was a lake...The reason I bring this up is that the article says there were no natural bodies of water, and even though this one wasn't widely known of, wasn't it still a natural body of water...or is this one of the man made springs...just curious... Coruscant nightlights 03:46, 2 December 2008 (UTC)Coruscant_nightlights

Problmes with Coruscant
I think teh wiki shoudl make a definate efrot and progect to step by step rebut the claims mad eby iregular webcomics and others and show how corruscant solves all these problmes. so far food ha sbemn solved.
 * What? --  Riffsyphon  1024 11:27, 4 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Is that intentional? 11:39, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

File:Coruscant view EII 1.jpg
is apparently from Attack of the Clones and yet the caption labels it as an image of Corusant in 32 BBY, the year of The Phantom Menace. If it is from Attack of the Clones, then the caption should say 22 BBY. Which should it be?--The Traveller 20:27, 26 February 2009 (UTC)