Talk:Revan/Legends

Revan's Height
Hi everyone! Just a quick thought on Revan's height. Malak's Databank and Wookieepedia entries put his canon height at 2 metres tall. Standing the KOTOR models for Revan and Malak next to each other for comparison (e.g. http://www.andargor.com/kotor-fun/KotOR0002b_Med.jpg), we can clearly determine (since Malak is 200cm tall), that Revan is 168cm (5 feet & 6 inches) tall. Personally, I wish they'd specified Malak as being a LOT taller than 2 metres so Revan could be slightly taller, but canon is canon I suppose. Also, Yoda was a LOT shorter than 5'6", and he was pretty damn powerful too, haha! If anyone has any thoughts on this, I'd like to hear them. Regards, LtKettch 21:05, June 16, 2011 (UTC) I measured the male Scoundrel, Scout and Soldier models. We have one model's height from the comparison with Malak's model (at 200cm). Since we can reasonably assume that this 5'6" model is the smallest (Scoundrel), Soldier Revan would be 176.5cm or 5'9.5" while Scout Revan would be 171.5cm or 5'7.5". Good catch, BlasterS33. Thanks for the feedback. Any other thoughts? LtKettch 23:04, June 19, 2011 (UTC)
 * Well the height of Revan is different for each model. The scoundrel being the smallest and the soldier being the tallest. You should check it in the game actually but you sure he is 5f6? because I mean I am not even sure the scoundrel is that short lol BlasterS33 22:04, June 16, 2011 (EST)
 * I'm glad you brought up the differing Class heights - I had the same thought after my initial post.
 * If we can establish a canon source for his Class, then we can issue his corresponding height:
 * Revan (if he was a Soldier)=5 feet 9.5 inches or 176.5cm.
 * Revan (if he was a Scout)=5 feet 7.5 inches or 171.5cm.
 * Revan (if he was a Scoundrel)=5 feet 6 inches or 168cm.
 * Also, I've ruled out the possibility that the Revan model used for the Malak comparison (http://www.andargor.com/kotor-fun/KotOR0002b_Med.jpg) is female. It's definitely a male, as all male KOTOR models stand with both feet angled outwards, as shown in the comparison picture. A female Revan model would have her right foot pointing straight ahead, and her left pointing to the side. She would also be dropping her hip, which our comparison model is not doing. The model used for the Malak comparison must therefore be a Male Scoundrel (at 5'6"). LtKettch 23:38, June 19, 2011 (UTC)
 * All this is speculation that doesn't help improving the article. –Tm_T (Talk) 03:48, June 20, 2011 (UTC)
 * I respectfully disagree. BlasterS33 has presented an excellent and pretty conclusive argument that Revan was in fact a Scout (See above section "Revan's Class"). Once this is confirmed, we will also have his height at 5' 7.5". LtKettch 20:05, June 20, 2011 (UTC)
 * Seriously, this is all speculation without canonical source stating it, thus far the authors have been clear there's no canonical class for Revan, yet. Estimation of the height from the models is also pure speculation. –Tm_T (Talk) 06:00, June 21, 2011 (UTC)
 * It is speculation, but I'm not too sure that basing the height of the models would be. Especially since there are different heights for each class. That's almost like saying that estimation of appearance from the models is also pure speculation.  Ruthless Xero (Comment) 06:40, June 21, 2011 (UTC)
 * We cannot trust the models are in perfect scale. What we can estimate from the models, is if something is significantly smaller/larger than the other, but that's it, no hard numbers. –Tm_T (Talk) 06:46, June 21, 2011 (UTC)
 * Eventually novel Star Wars: The Old Republic: Revan will shade some light to this character, but in the meantime, please let's keep all unsourced speculation off. –Tm_T (Talk) 07:18, June 21, 2011 (UTC)
 * Revan is shown to be as tall as Malak in the Timeline videos, but it's probably not canon. 82.32.105.111 16:41, June 21, 2011 (UTC)
 * If you are referring to the timeline videos on TOR website, then they are considered canon. But Tm_T is right. This is all just speculation and we need to just wait and see. Cal Jedi Infinite Empire.svg (Personal Comm Channel) 00:04, June 22, 2011 (UTC)

KoTOR 2 non-canon now?
Given that from what I've read on the internet through various sources both here, and on Bioware's ToR page, it seems that KoTOR 2 is going to be axed from canon.

Just out of curiosity, how is that going to affect Revan, post KoTOR? What was said about him (canon-wise) in the first, versus the second? I know that others have listed the video from SW:TOR talking about his "Rebirth" and we obviously don't know anything about that until the game gets into an open beta, but was it KoTOR 2 that sent him off into the great unknown, or was that just the Exile following after him.

Been -ages- since I played the games, so I'm a little rusty on my game history. Darth Vael 15:52, July 15, 2011 (UTC)
 * As far as I know, Bioware said, that the events from KotOR II won't have much efect on TOR, but are not considerd non-canon. What made you think that KotOR II ist now non-canon. Gulomi Jomesh 08:49, July 16, 2011 (UTC)


 * The first thing that comes to mind is Taris. I could be wrong about this, but the picture that ToR has painted is rather different from the Taris we knew in the second KoTOR. In the second one, Taris was the subject of a massive terraforming effort (pushed by Carth, I believe) to make it inhabitable once more. Outside of a strip of the planet that the Republic had been working on, it was described as a 'toxic soup' or something of the kind.


 * However, by the time of SW:ToR, they've made it sound like it was never really bothered with, and that it was mostly ruins and massive plant-life, certainly nothing like Obsidian had suggested with the planet being a 'toxic stew.' Darth Vael 13:04, July 16, 2011 (UTC)


 * Taris was never in KoTOR 2. You're thinking of Telos, an entirely different planet. --  I need a name  ( Complain here ) 13:07, July 16, 2011 (UTC)
 * Several things could have happened, one it could be that the transformation did take place. It could also be that everything eventually grew back by itself. You have to remember that TOR takes place a long time after KOTOR II, 1,000 years or so if I remember right. So I'd say that KOTOR II will still be considered canon, and TOR will be also. And they'll just find some way to explain the little discrepencies. Cal Jedi Infinite Empire.svg (Personal Comm Channel) 13:11, July 16, 2011 (UTC)
 * KoTOR 2 won't be non-canon. SWTOR.com's FAQ states that TOR takes place three hundred years after KoTOR, which is practically the same for KoTOR 2. TK999 —[Discuss] 13:24, July 16, 2011 (UTC)


 * Gah, you're totally right about Telos. Jesus, it's been a long time since I played those. Sorry for the confusion on my end, folks. Darth Vael 15:36, July 16, 2011 (UTC)

Also, it's important to note that the Revan novel, specifically advertised by Bioware, contains the Jedi Exile, and gives a brief summary surrounding the events that happened in KOTOR 2 (with Kreia and the Purge). As such, KOTOR 2 is fully cemented in canon and BW will not ignore it, especially considering the Jedi Exile appears in game.--160.39.157.69 04:21, November 16, 2011 (UTC)

Revan Alive in TOR?
I recently found this on Revan, and it appears he was the captive Jedi on Taral V. I don't really believe this, but I thought I should share this with the rest of you. http://darthdestruktor.deviantart.com/art/The-Old-Republic-Revan-Lives-261353296 LordDeathRay 01:23, October 8, 2011 (UTC)
 * While it looks OK, this image is not from an official source and therefor can not be used here as we cannot be sure if it is real or a fake. We need to wait for an official confirmation that Revan is alive to include that in the article. Gulomi Jomesh 08:36, October 8, 2011 (UTC)
 * Fair enough. I just wanted to give you guys a heads-up. LordDeathRay 14:44, October 8, 2011 (UTC)

Revan in Old Republic? (continued)
I've been browsing wookieepedia a bit, and I've come up with these timelines: Revan (character): If Revan were to appear in The Old Republic MMO, this would mean that lived for over 300 years. Has this been confirmed anywhere?
 * Old Republic MMO: Between 3,643 BBY and 3,641 BBY
 * Some time before 3,963 BBY, Revan, along with Alek, attained the rank of Jedi Knight.
 * In 3,653 BBY, at the start of The Sacking of Coruscant and The Cold War, the galaxy believed that Revan and the Exile never returned from unknown space.
 * The Old Republic: Revan (novel): Between 3,956–c. 3,951 BBY

From what I understand, the MMO kicks off with The Great Galactic War, which lasted from 3,681 BBY to 3,653 BBY. Its end also marks the beginning of the Sacking of Coruscant, as seen in the Deceived trailer, as well as The Cold War.

Given the timelines I have dug up regarding Revan, this would most certainly indicate that Revan was indeed alive during the events of The Old Republic MMO. On the other hand, given the vast amount of significant events occurring during in this MMO, the timeline provided in the page's infobox (Between 3,643 BBY and 3,641 BBY), seems very off.

Can anyone acknowledge the above? Or perhaps elaborate any incorrect assumptions I might have made? --KratosGodofWar (Radi0n) 11:49, October 31, 2011 (UTC)
 * Until there's a published, official source that Revan is alive during TOR, we assume nothing. So speculating about that can be forgotten. Also about the timespan of the game, as it's from an official source, it's what it is no matter how whacky it might appear (for what I know this one makes sense too). (: –Tm_T (Talk) 12:35, October 31, 2011 (UTC)

It is confirmed that the Emperor is keeping Revan alive in stasis, and it is also confirmed that the Exile is a Force Ghost that stays by Revan. Also, there is a flashpoint on Taral V in TOR where the players are instructed by a Force Ghost to rescue a Master Jedi that is invaluable to the war effort. Although it is not explicitly confirmed to be Revan, it makes the most sense, with the ghost being the Exile.--160.39.157.69 04:19, November 16, 2011 (UTC)

http://www.g4tv.com/thefeed/blog/post/707335/darth-revan-confirmed-for-star-wars-the-old-republic/ Here you go. BlasterS33 07:34, November 16, 2011 (UTC)BlasterS33

Canon face
So with the book finally released can we establish a canon face? Because to where I am now in the book SPOILER ALERT YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! His son is said to have the same *dark* eyes as him and the same dark shoulder lenght hair and on all the revan model for the game there is only one shoulder  lenght hair guy and he has dark eyes. But his hair is not black and it is specified that he has black hair in the book. So what are your toughts about this? Which one do YOU prefer? BlasterS33 08:03, November 16, 2011 (UTC)BlasterS33
 * Black hair plus dark eyes and pale skin means that the bald asian guy with the beard is the canon Revan. In the book Revan says he shaved off his beard so people won't recognise him, so it makes sense that he would grow his hair long for the same reason. It makes even more sense when you consider Satele's slightly asian features. At least the book was good for something. 86.145.92.130 13:35, November 16, 2011 (UTC)
 * Someone needs to upload a good pic! Mullet man was never going to be canon. There are countless nameless Republic troops, Jedi and other NPC's with that face scattered throughout both games. Jayden Matthews 15:20, November 16, 2011 (UTC)
 * Yeah well I think we will just have to wait for TOR for an appearance. I'm not sure he will be in it but I mean SPOILER ALERT the Emperor IS keeping him alive so it's possible we will see him in TOR also as one or 2 link above someone posted a picture of him and SPOILET AGAIN the Jedi Exile's force ghost so it's possible we will see what their faces looks like. ANd if I remember well and IT IS real pictures then Revan is not the Asian guy as in the picture he was caucasian. So this would mean there is not really a canon face or Revan in the game. As for me I prefer to think he is the long haired one and they just dyed his hair or something. As for the face of Meetra (Jedi Exile) there is not one with blue eyes and brown hair so we can assume this is the same thing for her.BlasterS33 11:38, November 17, 2011 (UTC)BlasterS33
 * I think the post you are refering to was deleted. If you are able to find it again, I would be very gratefull. Black hair + dark eyes + fair skin means that there are four possible faces that could be the true Revan, all of them asian. Jayden Matthews 11:56, November 17, 2011 (UTC)
 * Well, not Asian, but you know what I mean. I've e-mailed Drew, so hopefully he'll clarify the issue for us. As for Meetra, there is a face that has fair skin, brown hair and blue eyes. It's the same face that the miniture was based on. This is now indisputably the canocial one, so we should upload a good screenshot to go in place of the current pencil sketch. Jayden Matthews 13:41, November 17, 2011 (UTC)
 * If you coul tell me which face you are talking about I would be very grateful and as a little gift :D in advance look at this site someone uploaded it MAJOR SPOILER!!! (url removed) Revan And the Exile :) now we know their true faces! and we know Revan is not asian still please tell me which of the exile faces you are talking about with blue eyes and brown hair ^^ BlasterS33 18:06, November 17, 2011 (UTC)BlasterS33
 * Thanks for that video link, BlasterS33. I don't think it contains any real spoilers, I think we all knew what was going to happen in TOR regarding Revan! Regarding the canon face issue, I would like to recall a picture from a year or so back, speculating Revan's canon head from KOTOR:

Having watched your video, Revan's face is IDENTICAL to the KOTOR option highlighted in red. There can be no longer be any doubt whatsoever that this was indeed his canon face. I must say I'm glad, as this was IMO the best one. LtKettch 12:23, November 18, 2011 (UTC)
 * On a side-note, did anyone else pick up on the Messiah-vibe when they saw the video? He looks exactly like Jesus, he was suspended with his arms outstretched (crucifixion imagery?), which he endured to save the galaxy from Vitiate's hunger (suffering to save souls from the devil?) and there was even a crown-of-thorns thing going on where his famous crown had been burned into his face. Straining the metaphor, you could compare Revan, Satele & Meetra to the trinity of Father, Son and Spirit.

I'm not remotely religious, but I thought it was a very nice touch, particularly considering how many of us have come to regard Revan over the years! LtKettch 12:23, November 18, 2011 (UTC)
 * Guys, what's the hold-up? It's been eight years since KotOR was released and Revan finally has a canon face. Can someone please upload a decent pic? Jayden Matthews 13:26, November 18, 2011 (UTC)
 * The video from TOR is a leak, so if a new image is to be uploaded it will have to be an old one from the first game. 86.164.173.25 13:47, November 18, 2011 (UTC)
 * Is the fact that Revan has a canon face not significant? Are we just going to ignore it. Or is the book not considered canon. Come on guys, pull your finger out! 86.164.173.25 16:33, November 18, 2011 (UTC)
 * I know, I've saved some headshots from the video (url removed), but for some reason I'm having trouble uploading them. That's why I had to use an already-existing photo to make the comparison. I'll try again now, but if someone else could get some screen captures, you might have more luck than me and my useless computer! :) LtKettch 00:13, November 19, 2011 (UTC)
 * Right, I can't upload any photos which is really annoying. It says if I try any more I might get blocked, so I'll leave it to you guys. (url removed) The best screenshot is at 0:21, but there's another good one at 0:57. Wait until he's still and the subtitles have disappeared and take a full-screen capture. LtKettch 00:47, November 19, 2011 (UTC)
 * It's not just you. I can't upload either. As was pointed out above the video was leaked illegally, so we can't use anything from it anyway. There's probably no point in changing the main image now, as it will just be changed again when TOR is released. I do think we should add some pics from the first game that show his real face. though. Jayden Matthews 09:01, November 19, 2011 (UTC)
 * We cannot and we will not use any leaked video or other unpublished information here in Wookieepedia. Also please don't share those links either. –Tm_T (Talk) 13:41, November 19, 2011 (UTC)
 * The NDA has been lifted for several days now. There is nothing to "leak." --Imperialles 14:52, November 19, 2011 (UTC)
 * Several days? Url? (: –Tm_T (Talk) 15:06, November 19, 2011 (UTC)
 * See Forum:SH:TOR spoiler precautions and this. Cheers, grunny &#64; wookieepedia :&#126;$ 15:14, November 19, 2011 (UTC)
 * So within last 24 hours, and several links I did remove were posted before that. Good to know it's free from nda, thanks. (: –Tm_T (Talk) 15:20, November 19, 2011 (UTC)

Add to his biography
Should his actions in the novel be added to the biography or be kept until the truth of what happened in 3950 BBY becomes obvious in the game? --Senjuto 17:59, November 18, 2011 (UTC)
 * It should be added, along with a new main image that shows his face. Jayden Matthews 18:04, November 18, 2011 (UTC)


 * We need the biography updated to reflect Revan leaving Bastila up to his defeat and subsequent placement into stasis for the next 300 years. --Senjuto 02:39, November 22, 2011 (UTC)

I have knowledge of the new Revan novel, but have never played KotoR, unfortunately, and cannot be certain that anything I change might be different in KotoR. It seems a decent amount was retconned, like Revan beginning his journey with Canderous Ordo instead of HK-47 (and leaving everyone else behind for practical reasons, versus a desire to avoid attachment), him taking T3-M4 with him into the unknown regions, and him favoring the single-bladed style, versus the dual blades seen in KotoR II. Not to mention a bunch of other stuff I can't mention for spoilers' sake, except that he is indeed married to Bastila Shan (as mentioned on page four). Also, I've no idea what to keep hidden for TOR's sake. User: Barren167. Quote: Darth Caedus: Childhood fan-character ruined. 15:01, November 22, 2011 (UTC)

New main image.
Now that the NDA has been lifted would it be acceptable to change the main image to one from TOR? If not, for whatever reason, perhaps we could add one from the first KotOR game, as both TOR and the novel make it perfectly clear which of the selectable faces is the canon one. Anyway, here is a file for consideration. Jayden Matthews 16:22, November 19, 2011 (UTC)


 * No, we should hold off for now. Bioware has asked us not to publish any TOR spoilers before the game has been released, which this definitely qualifies as. --Imperialles 17:09, November 19, 2011 (UTC)
 * The spoiler being Revan's appearance in the game itself? I'm pretty sure it was confirmed some time ago by Bioware. The fact that he finally has a face is not really a spoiler, as it has already been revealed in the book. 86.164.173.25 17:29, November 19, 2011 (UTC)

The fact that he has a canon face in the obvious TOR style is very much a spoiler for someone who happens upon this page pre-TOR release. It's confirmation that Revan appears alive in TOR. It's a spoiler, so keep it off the page. 129.10.231.86 20:10, November 19, 2011 (UTC)
 * Just a heads up: Darth Vader is Luke Skywalker's father! If people don't want to be spoiled they shouldn't come to this site. Bioware revealed that Revan would be in the game months ago. It is not a spoiler. 86.164.173.25 20:45, November 19, 2011 (UTC)
 * We generally don't put up stuff before they're released, and then the first month the article has spoiler tagging. Internet is full of spoilers, yes, but please do respect community decisions. (: –Tm_T (Talk) 22:24, November 19, 2011 (UTC)
 * Just for the record guys, I've recived a reply e-mail from Drew and he verified that none of the selectable faces from the game are canon. Revan's appearance was modeled after a piece of concept art from TOR. I will forward the e-mail to any who would like to read it. Jayden Matthews 10:47, November 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * Hey can you send me the e-mail ? On *my talk* if you can thanks! BlasterS33 14:25, November 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * Could you please post the e-mail here? --Imperialles 15:03, November 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * Sure. Should I write it out word for word, or upload a screenshot? Jayden Matthews 15:33, November 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * Either a copy/paste or screenshot works fine. --Imperialles 15:53, November 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * I've uploaded a screenshot, as it seems more legit. Karpyshynemail.JPG Jayden Matthews 16:06, November 24, 2011 (UTC)

Revan novel retconning part of KotoR ending, debatable spoilers not related to above topic.
All right, I can't do anything on the Project The Old Republic page, because the "make new topic" button just leads me to the recent activity page. Thus, I'm putting this in the relatively more appropriate topic, here. How do I work with the differences established between the events stated about Revan's departure in KotoR/KotoR II, and the recent "retcons" of similar information in the novel Revan? Would there be a new section for the differences in behind the scenes, do I just use the retconned material and removed the old, or is there another solution? EDIT: Forgot to sign... User: Barren167. Quote: Darth Caedus: Childhood fan-character ruined. 03:13, November 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * Generally speaking, we use the more recent sources. Any retcons/discrepancies can be noted in the BTS seection. --Imperialles 15:05, November 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * Good, as that's what I've been doing anyway (as of yesterday). Now I can finally get this properly finished. User: Barren167. Quote: Darth Caedus: Childhood fan-character ruined. 16:08, November 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * Good work Barren :) --Senjuto 14:55, January 4, 2012 (UTC)


 * I don't see how that retcons KOTOR at all, much less any part of its ending. DigiFluid 15:13, January 4, 2012 (UTC)

Revan's Lightsaber
Hey guys, I was just thinking the lightsaber hilt featured in the article is the one Revan originally built in KOTOR to become a Padawan. SW:TOR:Revan's cover art (and leaked TOR Beta footage) shows us that sometime after defeating Malak, he constructed a new, seriously badass-looking lightsaber with a green blade. Possibly to indicate Masterhood. The article should be updated to include this.
 * As a side-note, has anyone noticed that when you combine Cyan (Mantle of the Force) and Orange (Heart of the Guardian), you get Green? At first I thought it was weird that Karpyshyn gave him a Consular saber, but could his new weapon contain both legendary crystals? It would explain why they weren't in KOTOR2, and would allow TOR players to utilize them once they free Revan in-game (he is seen wearing his lightsaber in stasis). This would fit the crystals' M.O. of "appearing at times of great turmoil to deliver the galaxy into salvation". LtKettch 06:28, November 25, 2011 (UTC)
 * Do you have any proof that we can use them in TOR or is that only speculation? BlasterS33 09:15, November 25, 2011 (UTC)
 * It's just a heads-up of something we should look out for - I thought it was pretty weird that there was no mention of them in the novel. The new lightsaber should definitely be added, though. LtKettch 14:08, November 25, 2011 (UTC)

Revan Is the Jedi held prisoner on Taral V
I recently watched the developer walkthrough on Taral V and a few things struck me as being coincidence. First when Oteg summons the female force ghost, the ghost talks about how the prisoner has been fighting the Empire or the "darkness" for some 300 years. Second, the ghost has to leave after conversing with Oteg and the group of individuals who are going to fight to free the jedi prisoner on taral V because her conversation with Oteg weakens her. In recent book titled Star Wars The Old Republic: Revan, Meetra Surik aka "The Jedi Exile," is killed and refuses to pass on into the Force instead her essence stays behind to give Revan strength because he has become a prisoner of the Sith Emperor. Plus the prisoner has been resisting the Empire for 300 years and Revan was captured some 300 years before the events of Star Wars The Old Republic. These coincidences are one to many to ignore. Let me know what you think?

link to the youtube video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E6L-N4zqAeM

Rac Ward


 * Yes, Revan is the prisoner. It's already been revealed in the video in one of the above sections. We can't add it to any articles until the game comes out, however, as it is considered a spoiler. Jayden Matthews 10:24, November 27, 2011 (UTC)

Its a spoiler people are figuring out very quickly. I havent even read the book and I was able to figure it out by using the information on this website and the info from the video on youtube. Its a spoiler Bioware let slip along time ago.

Rac Ward


 * It has to be kept a secret anyway Someone asked someone not to say anything here, and no matter how debatebly obvious it is, we still have to keep appearances, as well as hiding it from any who don't know and don't read this page. Or so I's assume. User: Barren167. Quote: Darth Caedus: Childhood fan-character ruined. 14:31, November 27, 2011 (UTC)

Battle with the Emperor (spoilers)
This section is needed to be filled to reflect what occurred in the novel. --Senjuto 16:07, November 28, 2011 (UTC)


 * I'm working on it, expect it before Sunday (I've the book from the library, and it's due by then). That, and the content of the book as a whole, which should be a lot easier now that the part I've no knowledge of (ties with KotOR II) are past. EDIT: For that matter, I've finished with the rest of the sections as much as I currently see them needing to be expanded, it's only the last third of the book, a relatively content-lacking section, that needs adding. Namely, the destruction of the Dark Council and the fight with the Emperor. User: Barren167 Darth Caedus: Childhood fan-character ruined. 21:31, November 28, 2011 (UTC)


 * Prison Break section in, as well as the beginning of the section on the Battle with the Sith Emperor. Tomorrow, I finish it, unless someone beats me to it (which would be most annoying, but understandable). User: Barren167 Darth Caedus: Childhood fan-character ruined. 03:39, November 30, 2011 (UTC)


 * Just in case I'm not actually talking to myself. As might be seen, it didn't get done today, and I'll be busy tomorrow. Friday's the plan now... User: Barren167 Darth Caedus: Childhood fan-character ruined. 04:13, December 1, 2011 (UTC)


 * And it's done. Now the whole thing needs images, I think, as there are five new sections with no image since a KotOR image of the Ebom Hawk in the "A New Journey Begins" section. User: Barren167 Darth Caedus: Childhood fan-character ruined. 20:51, December 1, 2011 (UTC)


 * Nice work. And it doesn't necessarily need images if there's no suitable available. (: – Tm_T@Wookieepedia:&#126;$ 21:18, December 1, 2011 (UTC)


 * Only one I can think of is the book's cover, which is Revan in full "battle dress" on Dromud Kaas. I've no clue how to resize images here though. Also, thanks for the sourcing, I couldn't quite figure that out.User: Barren167 Darth Caedus: Childhood fan-character ruined. 21:43, December 1, 2011 (UTC)
 * Yeah! I have no idea why they used that image for the cover. That never happens in the book. He's in Jedi robes the entire time. They just re-used an image of Darth Revan from google or something, I bet.--Jet Twilights 03:30, December 2, 2011 (UTC)


 * Didn't notice that, but I never played the game. Now that I look at it, I see, armor, with the mask and green saber, and a novel-only planet. I guess they don't even want their book spoiling his look in the game. I guess images will have to wait until then, than. User: Barren167 Darth Caedus: Childhood fan-character ruined. 04:37, December 2, 2011 (UTC)

Rewrite
First, the opening paragraph of the sectionThe Mandalorian Wars pretty much resays everything that's said in the section The Revanchist. So I think that paragraph should be taken out.

Also, the novel Revan appears to say that Revan didn't embrace the dark side until after the emperor captured and tortured him and malak. So, should the section The Mandalorian Wars be rewritten since they say Revan started using the dark side during the mandalorian wars?

Birth Year
Revan's birth year should be 3,994 BBY because the novel takes place in 3,954 BBY; the novel refers that Revan was about fourty years old. I will change the birth year immediately. Dawth Mawl 21:57, December 5, 2011 (UTC)

It's only speculation it doesn't say he IS forty. BlasterS33 22:27, December 5, 2011 (UTC)
 * That's why it says .c (circa). It's an approximate date. Jayden Matthews 14:30, December 6, 2011 (UTC)
 * I didn't knew that sorry I took it out, I tought it was being put as an exact date.(Don't blame me for the circa thing I'm french and had never heard of it XD) BlasterS33 23:54, December 6, 2011 (UTC)
 * It's Latin, which is more a root language of French than it is of English :p DigiFluid 17:15, January 1, 2012 (UTC)

Lord Scourge = Sith Apprentice?
Since when was Lord Scourge one of Revan's apprentices? I REALLY don't remember him teaching him anything, especially any SITH teachings. If its referring to there little talks while Revan was in prison, I don't think that counts.--Jet Twilights 00:12, December 10, 2011 (UTC)


 * Technically, he wasn't Revan's apprentice. Unofficially, Revan did give him some honest insight on the Force after his prison escape, as well as saying "everything I told you was a lie, except for what wasn't", a famous Jedi teaching. User: Barren167 Darth Caedus: Childhood fan-character ruined. 01:01, December 10, 2011 (UTC)


 * Yeah. I had a feeling that wasn't quite right.--Jet Twilights 01:53, December 10, 2011 (UTC)


 * So would that be like an informal mentor, mentee thing?--Gboy4 11:17, December 10, 2011 (UTC)


 * More or less, though definitely very informal. Revan fed Scourge minor nuggets about the Force to try to manipulate his captor, and after the jailbreak, Scourge asked him some questions about Force visions. The relationship really wasn't anything more than that. DigiFluid 20:40, December 29, 2011 (UTC)

New main image
Now that the game has been released can we vote a new main image? I provided a potential candidate in one of the above sections. Jayden Matthews 16:13, December 23, 2011 (UTC)

I think this would make a great main image because you can clearly see Revan's face and he has his hood up, which is a character trade mark.Jedi Scioli 14:45, December 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * I don't see that we have a choice, really. -- Darth Culator  (Talk) 14:46, December 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * I think un-hooded would be better, but that's just me. I wouldn't say his hood is a trademark, his mask, yes. Jayden Matthews 14:54, December 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * What about this one? Made it myself. --Darth Stefan (Talk) 15:08, December 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * Yeah, that's a nice one. Someone with access to the game's files may be able to come up with a render, like the current main image. Jayden Matthews 15:20, December 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * I recommend using either the aforementioned image or the hooded one as the primary image for the article. The non-hooded image featured on the article fits better where it is (in the "300 years later" section). Revan4000 16:04, December 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * I cas my vote for the hooded Revan. It just....LOOKS better.--Jet Twilights 17:08, December 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * I vote for the hooded one!--ARC Commander Colt 17:13, December 24, 2011 (UTC)


 * I cannot upload it, but what do you think about that one?: Xhttp://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/843/revanface12.jpg/X --RS7 18:08, December 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * The hooded one looks great, put that one on!--Gboy4 10:47, December 25, 2011 (UTC)
 * This will need to be voted on, considering the length of time that the current image has been positioned for. Jayden Matthews 13:37, December 26, 2011 (UTC)
 * Why vote? Its not hard to see the majority of us want the hooded mask less picture. Just post it!--174.62.183.126 23:55, December 27, 2011 (UTC)
 * Those are the rules. Such matters are only open to registered users, just so you know. Jayden Matthews 19:09, December 28, 2011 (UTC)
 * I vote for that image. It has best lighting, it is from newest version of TOR and we clearly see his face. --RS7 20:18, December 29, 2011 (UTC)

I don't know about this. While it's nice to see his (current) canon face, I think he's as much the mask as he is the man. It's a pivotal focus of his life from the first time he dons it, and it once again becomes a defining item toward the end of Revan (he leaves it on even when he doesn't have to). It's kind of akin to Bruce Wayne IMO....yes he has that side of his life, but Batman is who he truly is. Same with Revan, as I understand/view/interpret the character. DigiFluid 20:36, December 29, 2011 (UTC)
 * I disagree with you 100%. Thats like saying that since Jango Fett's helmet is iconic, his profile should be him in his full Mando armor. The point is that Revan, or "The Artist Formally Known as Revan" has a face under the mask, and I think it should be seen. We have been waiting for a canon face for 9 years, so lets just vote on one of the two shown above, shall we?--Jet Twilights 06:43, January 1, 2012 (UTC)
 * That's a bit of a false comparison IMO. Jango Fett was, in the grand scheme of things, a man rather than a mask. His most notable contribution to history was providing a genetic template for the clone armies.
 * Revan is different. Revan defied the Order to save the Republic, defeated the Mandalorians, encountered the Sith Empire, and became dark lord--and the face of it all was his mask. When people talk about Darth Vader, the first image that springs to mind isn't Sebastian Shaw, it's the mask. Same with Revan; he's more than a man, he's an icon, a symbol.
 * Lastly, it doesn't matter how long we've been waiting for a canon face. Why on Earth should wait time have any effect on the options of a vote? I never said it must be a picture of the mask, but to exclude it as a voting option would be a strange and ridiculous way to go. DigiFluid 17:14, January 1, 2012 (UTC)
 * I think it's standard procedure to inlude the current main image in the voting options. An admin will need to get the ball rolling. Jayden Matthews 14:42, January 2, 2012 (UTC)

TOR confirms that "Revan" is not his real name.
When players ask him: ''We were never properly introduced in all the excitement. What should I call you?''

He says: ''Revan. It isn't my real name--never was--but it will do.'' --RS7 20:16, December 29, 2011 (UTC)


 * We knew this. He was called "the Revanchist" before he defied the Jedi Order, taking a truncated version ("Revan") as his name sometime during the Mandalorian Wars (just as Alek chose to call himself Malak in the same period). So while I haven't encountered the Revan quest yet in TOR, this isn't exactly news.


 * But it's the name he's best known by from the Mandalorian Wars until the end of his 'first' life, as well as the name he continued to live by in his 'second' life after he learned his true past (see Revan). I think this is really just trivia at best, and has no bearing on the state of the article. DigiFluid 20:29, December 29, 2011 (UTC)


 * Yes, I know. But it was hinted and most probable. Therefore, it seems likely that Revan is not his real name - from the article about Revan. Now we have a confirmation, that it is not his real name.--RS7 20:42, December 29, 2011 (UTC)


 * Fair. DigiFluid 17:06, January 1, 2012 (UTC)

Question!
Something I don't understand, is that Revan's defined as the most powerful Jedi of his time. So how is it he could lose to a mere Sith strike team? Like he said, he's defeated Mandalore, Malak, Nyriss etc. It makes no sense! Did his time in stasis weaken him? Did it also turn him to the dark side?

--Devan2 23:55, December 31, 2011 (UTC)


 * Yes, the Emperor was feeding on his power. He weakened him. Also, Revan had been corrupted after 300 years battling the Emperor's evil. --RS7 13:12, January 1, 2012 (UTC)

Do you think he's truly dead or will he return? --Devan2 15:09, January 3, 2012 (UTC)


 * I asked Drew Karpyshyn. His reply: "I don't want to spoil too much about Revan in the game, but I'll try to answer your questions. Revan's lines were really just an homage to Darth Malak's quote from KOTOR, though it's easy to imagine he had been a little corrupted after 300 years battling the Emperor's evil. As for Revan's final fate, you never actually see him die. He just sort of disappears, so we left the door open just a little bit in case we want to ever bring him back."


 * So I think that he may return.--RS7 16:02, January 3, 2012 (UTC)


 * I hope he does return, I'd like to see what will his final fate will be. --Senjuto, January 3, 2012 (UTC)


 * Ah thank you for that, and yeah I'd like to imagine he'd return in the finale against the Emperor. I also hope he somehow makes contact with Bastilla, or maybe the rest of his companions just to sort of end the story..--Devan2 23:15, January 5, 2012 (UTC)

Question
After he came out of his 300 year stasis did he meet his descendent Satele Shan?
 * Probably. After he was freed, he visited the Jedi Council on Tython to inform them of the Emperor. So he probably met Satele Shan there.--Darth Stefan (Talk) 12:01, January 3, 2012 (UTC)

Hope someone writes a story about the meeting so we know what happens when Revan meets Satele Shan. --Senjuto 15:18, January 3, 2012 (UTC)

Spoiler!
Tnx for spoilering me!!

After 300 years, the Sith finally invaded the Republic, resulting in the Great Galactic War. Revan, however, managed to stop the war by manipulating the Emperor into believing that peace was in his best interest, resulting in the Treaty of Coruscant.

MUCHO GRANDE THANK YOU!!!! -.-

make a spoiler hint or something. this is crap!


 * There's a spoiler banner for TOR right at the top of the article page. If you'd paid attention to it instead of ignoring, you might've avoided this problem. DigiFluid 14:15, January 3, 2012 (UTC)

Date of death
Someone had added it to the infobox as in 3653 BBY at the Foundry, referencing SWTOR as source. I removed that information for two reasons:

1) It contradicts the article's main body text, which explicitly states that his fate is unknown.

2) SWTOR takes place spanning 3643-41 BBY, so even if we agree on his death taking place at the Foundry, the date was incorrect by both decade and range versus exacting.

DigiFluid 21:43, January 3, 2012 (UTC)


 * He may have survived in some form, but his physical form is destroyed, which warrants being added to the infobox, as with Palpatine etc. If the date was incorrect, then it can be altered. Jayden Matthews 21:58, January 3, 2012 (UTC)


 * Okay. Someone who's played that mission should probably clarify the body text a little bit then. And also, with the game's date given as a range rather than an exact year, what would be the most correct way to proceed with the infobox then? ca. the first date of the range? The last? DigiFluid 22:08, January 3, 2012 (UTC)
 * I think it should be 3,643-3,641, and I did add (body destroyed) not sure what's unclear about that. Jayden Matthews 22:37, January 3, 2012 (UTC)


 * My point was not really that the infobox addition was unclear. You're right--it was quite clear. My point, rather, was that that addition to the infobox is at odds with the article body text which states:


 * "But before the final blow could be struck, Revan disappeared in a flash of light. Not a trace of him could be found. It is not known whether he became one with the Force or somehow managed to escape."


 * An uncertain fate according to the body text vs. a certain death in the infobox. It would be better and/or more correct if the two were complimentary rather than contradictory. DigiFluid 15:07, January 4, 2012 (UTC)


 * My thinking is that the game takes place in 3,641 as it is stated that the Cold War ends in 3,641. Senjuto 14:57, January 4, 2012 (UTC)


 * The game's date is given as a range, 3643-41 BBY. This has a citation from one of the devs at the TOR article page. DigiFluid 15:02, January 4, 2012 (UTC)
 * I'm opposed this! It is unknown if he really died in the Foundry. His body just disapeared. I think he survived somehow. So I wouldn't say he's dead. --Darth Stefan (Talk) 16:08, January 6, 2012 (UTC)
 * You're not opposed to me, I started this by questioning whether he was dead at all! ;) DigiFluid 15:24, January 9, 2012 (UTC)


 * Until his death is confirmed, giving him a date of death is speculation. --CrimsonAssassin 18:39, January 9, 2012 (UTC)

Main image vote
For the sake of proactivity I've started a vote to determine a new main image for Revan. Otherwise, it'll never get changed. In the voting options I've included the current main image, as well as the images that were discussed above. I haven't included the image I originally uploaded, as it's from the beta test period, and some subtle details of that scene have been altered, including the lighting. Instead, I've uploaded a new image from when the player meets Revan on Taris. Here, the lighting is at it's most natural, and the details of Revan's face are most visable, without being obscured by his hood. Jayden Matthews 16:43, January 9, 2012 (UTC)
 * UPDATE: I've added a new image to the selection. It has the advantage of being of a considerably higher resoloution than the others, but the disadvantage of being possessed by the same gloomy purple light that seems to infect all locations associated with the Empire;)

Current render

 * 1) This is the face most people know Revan as. It's been fine all this time, I see no reason to change it for TOR.&mdash; Cal Jedi Infinite Empire.svg (Personal Comm Channel) 16:45, January 9, 2012 (UTC)
 * 2) To lift from my own edit in the discussion higher up: "When people talk about Darth Vader, the first image that springs to mind isn't Sebastian Shaw, it's the mask. Same with Revan; he's more than a man, he's an icon, a symbol." Revan's like Batman--his mask is his true face, rather than his flesh and blood face. -- DigiFluid 16:58, January 9, 2012 (UTC)
 * 3) NaruHina  Talk Anakinsolo.png 17:05, January 9, 2012 (UTC)
 * 4) JRT2010 17:25, January 9, 2012 (UTC)

The Telos screenshot

 * 1) You can see his complete face.  Clone Commander Lee  Talk 16:45, January 9, 2012 (UTC)
 * It has the best lighting and we clearly see his face.--RS7 17:04, January 9, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1) Maxattac 17:06, January 9, 2012 (UTC)
 * 2) Jayden Matthews 17:30, January 9, 2012 (UTC)
 * 3) No-brainer. This one is both more canonically recent and you can actually see his face. 1358  (Talk)  19:09, January 9, 2012 (UTC)
 * 4) When picking profile images, Wookieepedia has always gone preferred non-helmeted images where available. That's why we have an image of Anakin's FACE instead of Darth Vader's mask, and Jango Fett's FACE instead of his helmet. It doesn't matter which is more recognizable; we're depicting the character, not his clothes. Also, that render is old and from and old game with graphics that are subpar to TOR. Darth Trayus ( Trayus Academy ) 20:39, January 9, 2012 (UTC)
 * 5) I know lots of people are annoyed because Revan's "true face" isn't their favourite (or mine for that matter), but that's no excuse for not keeping the article up to date, and accurate. Regardless of how iconic or recognizable his mask is, it's not his face. Keeping the masked image because of sentimental reasons such as "this is how I want remeber him" etc is just silly. As is comaprisons with characters from completely different franchises. –K.A.J•T•C•E• 10:48, January 10, 2012 (UTC)
 * 6) Per Xd. Corellian PremierRobotech.jpg along the watchtower 02:20, January 12, 2012 (UTC)
 * 7) Per Trayus. Bella&#39;Mia 05:28, January 12, 2012 (UTC)
 * 8)  grunny &#64; wookieepedia :&#126;$ 05:30, January 12, 2012 (UTC)
 * 9) Menkooroo 16:45, January 12, 2012 (UTC)
 * 10) Avengers 17:31, January 12, 2012 (UTC)
 * 11) TheRailwayMan 22:09, January 12, 2012 (UTC)
 * 12) Seems like the best choice.-- Exiled Jedi  Oldrepublic crest.svg (Greetings)  21:11, January 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * 13) Jedi Scioli 04:37, January 14, 2012 (UTC)
 * 14) BlasterS33 13:52, January 14, 2012 (UTC)

Comments
Is in TOR a image of him with the mask (and possibly, also the hood)? I think that'd be perfect. (Darth Kyofu 17:07, January 9, 2012 (UTC))
 * If such a thing exists (which I doubt, considering Revan's mask is involved in a different quest entirely), I would be behind this idea completely. -- DigiFluid 17:11, January 9, 2012 (UTC)
 * This is the face most people know Revan as. It's not his face. It's a piece of metal covering his face. DigiFluid - Yes, his mask is returned to him, and he wears it when fighting Imperial players. Jayden Matthews 17:30, January 9, 2012 (UTC)

Sorry if this detracts from the debate but I must ask: when was Revan on Taris during the Cold War? Was he actually ON Taris or is Taris merely the name of the ship he's found on after being rescued from his imprisonment by the Republic players, as the screenshot would seem to indicate? EDIT: I've checked; the ship Revan is on is the Telos, and that ship's interior matches the background of the 'Taris' screenshot. So where did this 'Taris' business emerge from? Is it but a simple mistake or has the name of the ship been changed in-game with the end of the beta? --TheRailwayMan 16:59, January 11, 2012 (UTC)

Revan's destiny and the Ajunta Pall dialogue in KOTOR
ForceSaken 00:12, January 13, 2012 (UTC) I suggest to create a reference to the Ajunta Pall dialogue from KOtOR1 which, in my opinion is really important and kind of shocking (at least for me). But one thing needs to be explained:

AP: "We were not the first to fall to the dark side (possibly a reference to the original Sith species). But we... had more power than those before us. It... came from elsewhere (where? The Infinite Empire? Or a different source?) PC: "What Do you mean? Came from where?" AP: "Our oldest secret. Only... only we would know, we lords. Only we would know where our power came from... PC: (Force Persuade) "Tell me the secret." AP: "The Force no longer touches my mind, human. And... even if it did I, I no longer remember our secret. The Force bristles in you... you must find this place with it... Or... have you? Or did you? Or... will you? Oh, so... many images. I... see your heart, human Jedi. I see your power, your pride. You... you will find the old place, the dark place... and you will regret it. PC: "Why? What is at this place?" AP: "So much power... it is blinding. I... I remember so little."

And now... was Pall referring to the Trayus Academy? The Star Forge? Or Dromund Kaas? Or to a different place? What are your opinions? I thing this is quite important since Pall was one of the first to fall to the Dark Side and therefore possesses many secrets of the ancient times. ForceSaken 00:12, January 13, 2012 (UTC)


 * Any answer to this would be pure speculation. But given a real-world context, BioWare could not have intended for that to refer to Malachor V or Dromund Kaas. -- DigiFluid 20:48, January 13, 2012 (UTC)

Revan on Taris?
I must ask: when was Revan on Taris during the Cold War? Was he actually ON Taris or is Taris merely the name of the ship he's found on after being rescued from his imprisonment by the Republic players, as the screenshot above would seem to indicate? EDIT: I've checked; the ship Revan is on is the Telos, and that ship's interior matches the background of the 'Taris' screenshot. So where did this 'Taris' business emerge from? Is it but a simple mistake or has the name of the ship been changed in-game with the end of the beta? --TheRailwayMan 12:49, January 14, 2012 (UTC)
 * I confused Taris with Telos. No biggie. Jayden Matthews 12:54, January 14, 2012 (UTC)
 * Ah, yes, I suspected as much... Still, it would have been nice had Revan gone back to where it all began. Sorry for blowing this out of all proportion.--TheRailwayMan 13:59, January 14, 2012 (UTC)