Wookieepedia:Featured article nominations/Joruus C'baoth (second nomination)


 * ''The following discussion is preserved as an archive of a featured article nomination that was successful. Please do not modify it.

(5 Inqs/2 Users/7 Total)
Support
 * 1) (Re)Nominated, after pulling it down a week ago and doing some work on it.  Chack Jadson  (Talk) 20:57, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
 * 2) Here ya go, Chack. Nice job! Much better than when I last read it a couple weeks ago. Keep up the good work, and go poke more Inqs to review it again :P  Greyman ( Paratus ) 21:02, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
 * 3) Much improved.  Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.jpg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 00:36, 8 January 2008 (UTC)
 * 4)  StarNeptune Talk to me! 18:18, 10 January 2008 (UTC)
 * 5)  Graestan ( Talk ) 17:35, 25 January 2008 (UTC)
 * 6) The prose and language is much, much better. Great work on this, Chack.  Master Aban Fiolli  {Alpheridies University ComNet} 20:42, 28 January 2008 (UTC)
 * 7) Queue this thing already. --  Darth Culator  (Talk) 00:23, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

Oppose
 * 1) From the Family-sized pasta bowl of Fiolli
 * 2) * Intro does not state that he was in fact a dark Jedi; It should also be mentioned somewhere in Creation.
 * 3) * Third paragraph of Creation: It says "this clone" became ruler of Wayland&hellip;" but does not explain. The intro implies that he was sent by Palpatine to be the Guard.
 * 4) ** Still uncertain as to whether Palpatine sent the clone to Wayland or not. Was there an edict or mission?
 * 5) ***Seems it could possibly be expanded even more, but I'll leave it to the Inqery to judge that. I'm not going to hold it up.  Master Aban Fiolli  {Alpheridies University ComNet} 01:08, 2 December 2007 (UTC)
 * 6) ****There is really nothing on C'baoth before Thrawn discovers him. I don't think anything definitively states he was sent by Palpatine, or how.  Chack Jadson  (Talk) 22:37, 18 December 2007 (UTC)
 * 7) * Third paragraph of Creation: can the details of the fight be expanded slightly? Not an objection, but a suggestion.
 * 8) * First paragraph of Service/Thrawn: "Upon revealing himself to the Jedi&hellip;" Would dark Jedi be better?
 * 9) * Same sentence: "told them" - A bit awkward since Thrawn was not mentioned as being accompanied.
 * 10) * Fourth paragraph of Service/Thrawn: "he would come to him." Not quite sure who goes to who in this statement.
 * 11) * Same paragraph: What/why was Skywalker skeptical? Was he skeptical about C'baoth?
 * 12) * Fifth paragraph of Showdown: "Luke's clone caused a strange buzzing in his head by simply being near him (a possible effect of clone madness)." Was the buzzing in Luke's head or Luuke's head (or both?) This clears up the next sentence of who was distracted.
 * 13) * Clone Identity: I know you didn't add these paragraphs, but I think the information is valuable. Perhaps better suited in P&T, though. The statements, however, do need to be sourced if they are in fact correct.
 * 14) * P&A: "He had the power to take control of other's minds, and literally reshape them in his own image, a feat unmatched by anyone before." Can this be sourced? It doesn't quite seem to be NPoV.
 * 15) **Better.
 * 16) *I am not an expert on all policy here, but here are some thoughts. Nice work, though. The article is better!  Master Aban Fiolli  {Alpheridies University ComNet} 05:45, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
 * 17) **Again, nice work, "Chack." Didn't know that much about the subject until now.  Master Aban Fiolli  {Alpheridies University ComNet} 23:29, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
 * 18) *From the desk of Atarumaster88
 * 19) * The minor point where Artoo blasts C'baoth and nearly kills him with a laser cannon burst might be important. (on Jomark)
 * 20) * The article dances around mentioning how C'baoth got back to Wayland but never discusses it explicitly. Please do so.
 * 21) * Chimaera is neither explained or linked. No context is given.
 * 22) **Still not linked on first mention and the last time it is used is in need of italics. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.jpg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 00:12, 5 December 2007 (UTC)
 * 23) ***Ugh. Fixed.  Chack Jadson  (Talk) 22:37, 18 December 2007 (UTC)
 * 24) * C'baoth's ability to send mental messages across distances needs a mention.
 * 25) * Why did that irrelevant section about Thrawn's death and Rukh and all that come back? I objected to that in this article's first round of nomination. It doesn't serve a purpose to the article and tells us nothing further about C'baoth. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.jpg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 00:12, 5 December 2007 (UTC)
 * 26) *Have a Super Terrific Friendly Un-frustrating Day. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.jpg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 19:36, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
 * 27) From the whosigowhatsit of Four Dot
 * 28) * The image use could be much, much better.
 * 29) **Satisfactory, or still not quite?  Chack Jadson  (Talk) 22:37, 18 December 2007 (UTC)
 * 30) ***Well, this isn't totally objectionable, but there are two images of him just standing there that could probably be replaced with "doing stuff" pictures. Thefourdotelipsis 21:58, 12 January 2008 (UTC)
 * 31) * You need to provide better context at the start of the "Service to Thrawn" section. Talk about why Thrawn wanted him, ect, ect.
 * 32) * And on that note, the second paragraph in that section is barely relevant to Joruus.
 * 33) * Why is there a section on the Ukio attack long before it actually happens?
 * 34) * "He began training Skywalker, teaching him many things contrary to what Yoda had taught the young Jedi, such as that Jedi were superior to others." - Unwieldy. Might want to rewrite that one.
 * 35) * And in the rest of that paragraph, there's a lot of repetition of "He did this. He did that".
 * 36) * I'm not sure exactly how the second last paragraph of "Service to Thrawn" is related to Joruus.
 * 37) * Been a while since I read the books, but wasn't there a scene where Joruus took over the Chimaera, albeit briefly?
 * 38) * Fifth paragraph of Showdown on Wayland. Again, I'm not really sure how it relates to Joruus. Can, and must be more concise.
 * 39) * The last paragraph could use some cleaning up too. Also, some aftermath to his death would be good, instead of "He exploded, the end."
 * 40) * P&T could do with some mention of the original C'boath, and how his traits were passed on.
 * 41) * P&A could be expanded quite a bit. Based on the image accompanying it alone.
 * 42) * BTS could do with some beefing up as well.
 * 43) **How is it now? There's really not much that can be added.  Chack Jadson  (Talk) 22:37, 18 December 2007 (UTC)
 * 44) * This might sound harsh, but I think this will require a lot of work to get up to scratch. If it can be done, well and good, but it's not going to be easy. I'm not as familiar with the original material as I should be, but I doubt, for some reason that every single source and appearance has been mined for information thoroughly, and that's really what has to happen before I support. Thefourdotelipsis 23:48, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
 * 45) Just one more thing
 * 46) * General Covell needs a mention by name, a link. The guy C'baoth bonds to his own brain in TLC, as I recall. It's a pretty impressive techinique. Every last scrap of pertinent detail, after all :P Harrar 20:35, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
 * 47) From the squalid cubicle of Graestan:
 * 48) * Image placement/sizing could use some tweaking.
 * 49) **How is it now?
 * 50) ***Please alternate their positioning, starting on the left, excluding the infobox. Graestan ( Talk ) 22:25, 23 January 2008 (UTC)
 * 51) ****Sorry, I always do that. For the last image, the concept art one, I think it's okay if it's on the right. See Anakin Solo for an example. Also, I know the images as a whole are not great. I personally cannot get any better ones,but if someone else could, I'd be very grateful.
 * 52) * Drop the parenthetical statement; it reads more as a casual aside, when in fact it could be stated.
 * 53) **Fixed.
 * 54) * I remember the TTT being hazy and full of guesswork regarding C'baoth's origins, but do we have to make it look that bad here, too?
 * 55) **Any better? That's kind of difficult to explain, but in my opinion it's important, and I'd like to keep it if possible.
 * 56) * Is "Guardian" a title to be capitalized? Check the books. If so, capitalize the rest; if not, de-capitalize Guardian of Mount Tantiss in the prose.
 * 57) **Fixed.
 * 58) * There has to be some article out there for that redlink.
 * 59) **Fixed.
 * 60) * I'm not big on speculative origins of names in the BtS. Unless there is an author confirmation, I think it should be left out of the article.
 * 61) **Fixed.
 * 62) * Per Fourdot on the information. Every stated source and appearance should have at least some information from it represented in the article; I typically check this merely by looking at the "Notes and references" section.
 * 63) **All non-Mo appearances, yes. Sources, no, unless there is new information provided in them. Greyman ( Paratus ) 20:51, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
 * 64) ***Yep. All sources have been checked.
 * 65) * Graestan ( Talk ) 05:10, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
 * 66) From the undisclosed location of Darth Culator:
 * 67) * Image arrangement just... bugs me.
 * 68) **Check it out.
 * 69) * Refs the Fact Files, but which Fact File?
 * 70) **I just went through all our fact file articles and found nothing on C'baoth. I assume he's simply mentioned in one of Thrawn's entries.  Chack Jadson  (Talk) 00:50, 23 January 2008 (UTC)
 * 71) * Image:Joruscbaoth.jpg is not the same as the HttE cover. Where is it actually from? And once we know that, can we get a clearer version?
 * 72) **I have no idea where it's from. Sorry, but even if I did, I would be unable to get a better version. If anyone else could help, I would most appreciate it.
 * 73) ***This will either need to be properly sourced, replaced with the version from the actual cover, replaced with a completely different picture, or removed entirely. -- Darth Culator  (Talk) 22:45, 1 February 2008 (UTC)
 * 74) ****Fixed it myself, since nobody can source the original. I'd still like to know where it comes from, though. -- Darth Culator  (Talk) 00:23, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
 * 75) * EGttF is listed in sources, but nothing refs it? Really?
 * 76) **Yeah. He's basically just mentioned once or twice. Should I remove it from the sources then, as it adds no info?  Chack Jadson  (Talk) 01:18, 7 January 2008 (UTC)
 * 77) ***No, leave it in, but a might be in order. --Eyrezer 20:54, 18 January 2008 (UTC)
 * 78) ****Thanks, though I'm not sure if such a tag is necessary.  Chack Jadson  (Talk) 00:50, 23 January 2008 (UTC)
 * 79) *That's it from me, for the moment. -- Darth Culator  (Talk) 18:48, 6 January 2008 (UTC)
 * 80) Toprawa says:
 * 81) * Reword the empty construction used to begin this sentence..."There, they found an old man"
 * 82) * If it's so important, why doesn't it link to a battle? "The Dark Jedi was later used at the assault on Ukio, one of the most important battles of the Thrawn campaign."
 * 83) * Avoid parenthetical text. If it's important enough to be put into the article, include it: "Around this time, C'baoth's madness became even more evident, as he frequently exploded in anger at Thrawn (usually about "his" Jedi) but would quickly calm down."
 * 84) * Specify what "this" is: "He had first tried this on the way to Wayland,"
 * 85) * This little paragraph is confusing. The previous para explains that he all but failed to take control of Covell's mind, killing him in the process. Clarify how he found success: "Having perfected his technique," Toprawa and Ralltiir 07:09, 28 January 2008 (UTC)
 * 86) **Wow, that was fast.  Chack Jadson  (Talk) 21:04, 28 January 2008 (UTC)
 * 87) A little more:
 * 88) * This paragraph, beginning "At this time, Leia Organa Solo, Han Solo, and Talon Karrde...," could be written better with less PBP. Toprawa and Ralltiir 02:55, 29 January 2008 (UTC)
 * 89) **Fixed.  Chack Jadson  (Talk) 21:12, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

Comments
 * 1) General prose still lacking. Can't support this until better. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.jpg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 03:27, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
 * 2) *Any better?  Chack Jadson  (Talk) 22:37, 18 December 2007 (UTC)