Wookieepedia:Featured article nominations/Lumiya (second nomination)

Lumiya

 * Nominated by:  —Tommy  9281  Tuesday, July 12, 2011, 22:20 UTC 
 * Nomination comments: Two years in the making. While my work and my life are not done, I would really welcome a rest nonetheless.

Support

 * 1) Pre-nom reviewed.  Master Jonathan &mdash; Jedi Council Chambers Tuesday, July 12, 2011, 23:06 UTC

Prepare to be savaged&hellip;

 * The BTS reads as if it was known all along that Brie and Lumiya were the same person, but I don't believe that was the case. Were they not separate characters that were later retconned into one? If so, the BTS should note which source specifically established their unified identity. If this was the plan all along, however, I guess I misunderstood my EU. :) ~ Savage BOB sig.png 18:07, August 10, 2011 (UTC)
 * The comics make clear that Brie was intended to be Lumiya all along. The only retcon I am aware of was identified in The Essential Chronology with regard to her Emperor's Hand status.  —Tommy  9281  Wednesday, August 10, 2011, 23:36 UTC 
 * OK, I'm reading through Marvel now, and guess I got some bad intel. I'll try to give the article a full review soon. ~ Savage BOB sig.png 14:12, August 11, 2011 (UTC)
 * OK, on to the lead: "His Imperial Majesty" seems quite strange in an encyclopedia article, and even seems a bit POV to me. Why not change it to just "Galactic Emperor"? He certainly wasn't "Imperial Majesty" to the Rebels.
 * You're #2 to make that suggestion, so I concede.  —Tommy  9281  Monday, August 29, 2011, 01:41 UTC 
 * A bit of context on the New Order is probably warranted.
 * Addressed.
 * "the latter of which" --> since the sentence is getting kind of long, I'd suggest either breaking it down a bit (either into two sentences or with a semicolon) or indicating "the latter goal of which" or somesuch to indicate what "latter" is referring to.
 * Addressed.
 * Since expatriation refers to nations and states, I'm not sure we can use it for Luke's leaving the Alliance. Perhaps exile?
 * Addressed.
 * It seems a bit strange to call her lightwhip infamous at first mention; it takes time to gain infamy, so it's almost anachronistic unless you add some clunky qualifier, like "which would become infamous." Probably best to just ditch it on first mention.
 * Addressed.
 * Lumiya's "defaulting" to Mistress of the Sith needs a bit of explanation. Why would their deaths change her ranking/title? ~ Savage BOB sig.png 00:55, August 29, 2011 (UTC)
 * Addressed.
 * Is her "similar Imperial program" worth an article? ~ Savage BOB sig.png 02:32, September 8, 2011 (UTC)
 * I would say nah, it's a really vague mention.  —Tommy  9281  Thursday, September 8, 2011, 06:34 UTC 
 * "A short time before circa 1.5 ABY," This time phrase is a bit confusing; is there a comma missing? (Sorry my review is taking so long...) ~ Savage BOB sig.png 02:37, September 8, 2011 (UTC)
 * Addressed. No worries about the review, I'm as patient as she is :P  —Tommy  9281  Thursday, September 8, 2011, 06:34 UTC 
 * "the domestic race..." Can you maybe come up with another word for "domestic"? Would "native" or "indigenous" work? Or "dominant"? "Domestic" reads weirdly to me, since I think it's more applicable to nation-states, not planets. Then again, this is Star Wars... ~ Savage BOB sig.png 12:48, September 12, 2011 (UTC)
 * Addressed.  —Tommy  9281  Friday, September 16, 2011, 04:52 UTC 
 * "To that end, Brie again joined Flying Bantha Squadron alongside Skywalker and two additional pilots, Alph and Hanc Thorben, to partake in a mission which involved the sabotage of the Imperial armada by infiltration of the fleet as disguised TIE pilots by means of the TIE fighters[28] that had been previously obtained on Bazarre station." This sentence is pretty long, especially where it starts talking about TIE fighters. Perhaps break it up? ~ Savage BOB sig.png 02:11, September 28, 2011 (UTC)
 * Addressed.  —Tommy  9281  Wednesday, September 28, 2011, 04:16 UTC 
 * Can you add a tad more context on King Adas? We're told he's legendary, so I kind of feel we need to know a bit about what he did to make him so. ~ Savage BOB sig.png 11:46, September 30, 2011 (UTC)
 * Addressed.
 * Is it Finn or the stormtrooper who is supposed to be the first to die? ~ Savage BOB sig.png 11:53, September 30, 2011 (UTC)
 * Addressed. I also removed the link for the stormtrooper, since he's one of many randomly insignificant stormtroopers.  —Tommy  9281  Friday, September 30, 2011, 23:02 UTC 
 * Just a couple of questions about the Epsilon Nine part: the first sentence of the third paragraph is a bit confusing, since it's hard to tell whether the Corvette and X-Wings are allied with Lumiya or the New Republic. Could you clarify which ships belong to which side?
 * Addressed.
 * I was trying to find some way to keep the word "traitors" without sounding POV; maybe add, "Those whom she considered traitors"? Elegant it ain't, but flat-out calling them traitors seems to run afoul of NPOV.
 * Addressed.
 * I linked the dude she chokes. Unlike the stormtrooper above, I think this guy deserves a stubby article, as he's got a picture and (presumably) a speaking role. I am ready to tackle the novel bits soon! ~ Savage BOB sig.png 14:24, October 9, 2011 (UTC)
 * "a massacre first enacted..." Can you add a few more words of explanation here? Was the slaughter of the Prophets unsuccessful for some reason? "A massacre first enacted but left incomplete by..." would suffice, I think, if that's what happened. ~ Savage BOB sig.png 14:34, October 9, 2011 (UTC)
 * Addressed.
 * "the galaxy was invaded by the extra-galactic invaders" --> Can you mix up the language a bit here to avoid invaded, invaders?
 * Lmao, funny how the eye's get crossed. Addressed.
 * Did the Vong plan to eradicate all technology, or simply all technology that wasn't biological in origin? I haven't read the NJO books, but my understanding of the Vong is that they do use tech, it's just their own style of tech, no? ~ Savage BOB sig.png 12:58, October 14, 2011 (UTC)
 * Check that out.  —Tommy  9281  Monday, October 17, 2011, 21:10 UTC 
 * OK, I'm back! "It was the subsequent secession movement for which the Five Worlds confederacy began to muster support that Lumiya decided to agitate in order to plunge the galaxy into conflict and enable the rise of Jacen Solo." This sentence is a bit unwieldy and hard to follow. Maybe split it in two?
 * I tried something, see if it is good now.  —Tommy  9281  Monday, November 7, 2011, 05:25 UTC 
 * "three ferals" -- what's a feral? ~ Savage BOB sig.png 15:33, October 22, 2011 (UTC)
 * Addressed.  —Tommy  9281  Monday, November 7, 2011, 05:25 UTC 
 * OK, almost done with the review. I've just finished reading through the biography, and once you switch from comics to novels, I feel the level of play-by-play gets to be a bit much. I'd suggest reading through the novel information and toning down on extraneous details, like specific moves made in various combats, specifics of tests given to Jacen Solo, extraneous maneuvers made by the Alliance fleet, etc. Unfortunately, this will require reading through the very long biography to simplify such details, but I feel that the current level of detail is perhaps too much. I should get through the P&T and BTS soon. ~ Savage BOB sig.png 15:32, November 18, 2011 (UTC)
 * I agree that it becomes more detailed with the transition, which is mostly cause by the absence of illustrations. That's because there is much (and I mean waaaaaaaay too much) conversation, much more than actual action. To remove much of what you describe will cause significant gaps in context. I know it does seem slightly PBP, but again, I truly feel those details are necessary to provide sufficient context.  —Tommy  9281  Friday, November 18, 2011, 17:15 UTC 
 * I'll give you some examples of stuff I think could be trimmed or summarized shortly. For now, though, I want to finish the full review. ~ Savage BOB sig.png 17:14, December 18, 2011 (UTC)
 * OK, finals are over and I can finally finish this review. My apologies it's taken so long. First, under "Appearance," you discuss her exuberance. Should this go somewhere else, since it doesn't pertain to her physical appearance?
 * Addressed.
 * There are a couple of monstrous paragraphs in the P&T, particularly the one starting with "Shira Brie underwent extensive&hellip;" and the one beginning with "Upon her transformation&hellip;" Would it be possible to break these up into at least two paragraphs each?
 * Addressed.
 * I don't think you ever outright say that the character known as Ship also went by the name Ship. You call him other things first and then just start talking about someone named "Ship." It took me off guard, and it's highly possible I just missed it, but can you check to make sure the character is identified on first mention or thereabouts?
 * Addressed.
 * This could just be my relative ignorance of longer character articles, but is it worthwhile to separate "Relationships" form "Interactions"? Why not fold the latter into the former or vice-versa? Or is "Relationships" reserved for romantic relationships? It seems like six of one, half a dozen of the other to me, and might make for more coherence to treat them in the same main subsection.
 * The traditional "relationship" section is designated solely for romances.  —Tommy  9281  Wednesday, January 11, 2012, 00:49 UTC 
 * I didn't change this, but I'm not sure embossed is the right term for describing the application of a metallic sheen. The way I understand it, embossing relates to carving or etching a design into a surface such that the design stands out in relief, hence my reservation with the word in this instance.
 * Addressed.
 * Should her Force-influenced mirrors have an article of their own, rather than simply pointing to the mirror article? They sound like they might warrant it.
 * No, they weren't that significant, they were just mirrors in her house that she put a spell on.  —Tommy  9281  Wednesday, January 18, 2012, 02:55 UTC 
 * Can you add dates to the first paragraph of "Character development?" Perhaps not dates for each issue in which she appeared, but the publication dates of her first appearance as Shira Brie and her first appearance as Lumiya would be useful. Similarly, you talk about "six years later" for her appearance in The Emperor's Pawns, but we don't have a date for six years later than what (for Lumiya: Dark Star of the Empire. Sprinkling a few years through the second paragraph would thus be helpful for the reader. Finally, it would be nice to have a publication date for at least her first portrayal in the Del Rey books, if not for all of them.
 * Addressed.
 * Should StarWars.com be italicized or no? It's both ways currently. I personally wouldn't italicize it.
 * Addressed.
 * Should you mention Hasbro somewhere in the BTS? There's an image but no mention that I can see.
 * Addressed.
 * Have you read through the article "How to Draw Star Wars the Marvel Way"? It probably has more helpful BTS information for you. That's it from me, Tommy. Excellent work on a monstrous topic. ~ Savage BOB sig.png 17:14, December 18, 2011 (UTC)
 * i don't have it, I'm working on getting the material, unless of course you could provide via email. Thanks for the review, Bob, please advise if anything further is required.

The Dolphin Attacks

 * Disclaimer: Keep in mind that this is only a preliminary review, and please contact me on my talk page if I forget to address any comments as I occasionally do.-- ID-21 Dolphin  DolphinJedi.png(Talk) 19:03, August 21, 2011 (UTC)
 * First of all, the intro should be cut to roughly 3/4 of its current size. I notice that you've been cutting it down over the last couple months, just a little more would be fine.
 * The lead quote is very vague and uninteresting; essentially it only states her name and her alias, which are already stated in the prose of the first paragraph. The quote at the top of |this revision is better suited because it offers more of an insight into her history and personality. Otherwise, if you can find another really good quote, I'm always open.
 * Speaking of quotes, the quote in the "legacy" section is waaaaay too long to serve its purpose. I would suggest keeping just the first four lines or otherwise the third and fourth line by themselves.
 * And the quote in "Seducing a Jedi" is also too long, which can be a little annoying for monologue. I would cut it down from "'Take what I have to teach you, Jacen'" to the end which makes it a much more concise and powerful quote.
 * In the first part of the biography, the Carida and Chinshassa images should be replaced with images of Lumiya herself as is preferable. There's a nice NEGTC images that was delted from the site some time ago for being unused, but it would probably fit best there. Other images like that of Flint and that of Rebel pilot Skywalker could be changed to some ofLumiya, since comics are usually high on images.
 * Also, for images, this one seems like too much of a stretch from Lumiya and the events in the book to belong in this section. This image of Lumiya would fit much better IMO seeing as it's always better to include images of the subject if possible.
 * I would add an imagecat to the Appearances section.
 * Some of the more verbose parts of the intro could be cut down; for example, "His Imperial Majesty Palpatine" is a little too grandiose and could be changed to simply "Emperor Palpatine".
 * Also, Lumiya should be mentioned as her main name in the first sentence of the intro, since having it at the end of the paragraph seems too far.
 * Otherwise great work. That's all for now.-- ID-21 Dolphin  DolphinJedi.png(Talk) 19:03, August 21, 2011 (UTC)
 * And by the way, that nomination comment is hilarious. :) -- ID-21 Dolphin  DolphinJedi.png(Talk) 19:04, August 21, 2011 (UTC)
 * The intro is well in proportion with the article proper. It was once said that there is a subtlety to quote selection that few writers possess; such is the case with the lead quote. Other things like image and quote choice, etc. are matters of preference; I happened to write the current version of the article, complete with images that reflect the particular sections in which they are found. Basically, each of these preliminary objections qualifies as a matter of stylistic opinion rather than issues that warrant objection.  —Tommy  9281  Sunday, August 21, 2011, 19:15 UTC 
 * These objections have been addressed for more than three weeks now. I request that they be stricken by the Inquisitorius.  —Tommy  9281  Friday, September 16, 2011, 04:52 UTC 

Jujiggum

 * In Joining the Rebellion: "Enraged by the revelation, the fabrication went, Brie sought out the Alliance and decided to enlist." A word missing here? (Or am I just reading this incorrectly&hellip;?)
 * Addressed.
 * Absolutely fantastic stuff so far, Tommy. I'll continue with Lieutenant Brie. Jonjedigrandmaster  ( Talk ) 15:31, December 1, 2011 (UTC)
 * "on a mission to D'rinba IV to disable the superlaser of the second Death Star." Link for the mission? Were they successful or not?
 * From what I understand, the game doesn't make clear the outcome of the mission, so I didn't include on in the final article cut.  —Tommy  9281  Wednesday, December 28, 2011, 00:51 UTC 
 * "Shalyvane's Em'liy natives ambushed the Rebels and forced them to take cover." Link for this skirmish, too?
 * Redlinked for later.  —Tommy  9281  Wednesday, December 28, 2011, 00:51 UTC 
 * Continuing with Rebirth later. Jonjedigrandmaster  ( Talk ) 19:46, December 1, 2011 (UTC)
 * I'll pick up with Nagai–Tof conflict. Apologies for having to do this review in such small increments; feel free to work through these objections as I go. Jonjedigrandmaster  ( Talk ) 03:29, December 10, 2011 (UTC)
 * Link for the first ambush on and later mission to/skirmish on Kinooine? What about the subsequent rescue mission?
 * Redlink for the first, second one is the Skirmish on Kinooine.  —Tommy  9281  Wednesday, December 28, 2011, 00:51 UTC 
 * Link for the mission to destroy the Prophets of the Dark Side? I'll continue with Striking from the Shadows later. Jonjedigrandmaster  ( Talk ) 21:11, December 17, 2011 (UTC)
 * Redlinked.
 * "She made her way back to the Yuuzhan Vong, mid-year, whereupon she inveigled her way into the confidence of Tsavong Lah himself." I'm not catching the mid-year reference here, and I'm not certain on what you mean with the wording, either. I'll continue with Puppetmaster. Jonjedigrandmaster  ( Talk ) 16:47, December 22, 2011 (UTC)
 * When you say not catching mid-year, what do you mean? The source describes the events as having occurred mid year. And the wording has also been adjusted. Thanks thus far for the review Jon, I look forward to the rest. I'll be taking care of the redlinks asap.  —Tommy  9281  Wednesday, December 28, 2011, 00:51 UTC 
 * No problem. For the mid-year, I'm not sure exactly to which year you're referring (the last one you named was 25 ABY, but I'm pretty sure this was later). Jonjedigrandmaster  ( Talk ) 03:31, December 28, 2011 (UTC)
 * Addressed.  —Tommy  9281  Thursday, January 26, 2012, 01:13 UTC 
 * "&hellip;but dismissed any further conversation as they ascended Dour floors in a turbolift&hellip;" Typo? Continuing with Sith Master later. Jonjedigrandmaster  ( Talk ) 18:00, January 6, 2012 (UTC)
 * Lol addressed.
 * "Under the assumption that Lumiya had intentions of vengeance on Ben Skywalker, the Skywalkers immediately intercepted the Colonel&hellip;" Please mention at some point before this that Jacen became a Colonel; otherwise, the reader might get confused.
 * Addressed.
 * "The meeting was a twofold trap, however, as Lumiya agreed to also venture to Roqoo Depot under to secretly oversee Ben Skywalker's safe passage to the Anakin." Typo? I'll continue with Interference asap. Jonjedigrandmaster  ( Talk ) 16:16, January 20, 2012 (UTC)
 * Addressed.
 * What was the "Syo package?"
 * The book literally gives no supporting details about the Syo package, nor does it ever mention it again afterward. Including that was very awkward because of our context requirement, but none whatsoever was given in the book.  —Tommy  9281  Thursday, January 26, 2012, 01:13 UTC 
 * "&hellip;but was surprised to find Alema Rar also present and intent on killing Mara Jade Skywalker, also on station with her husband, and the fast approaching Han Solo." Do you mean that Rar was intent on killing Mara and Han? Either way, please make this a bit clearer. Continuing with Victory later. Jonjedigrandmaster  ( Talk ) 16:03, January 24, 2012 (UTC)
 * Addressed.  —Tommy  9281  Thursday, January 26, 2012, 01:13 UTC 
 * "When she lost her footing and fell, dropping her lightwhip into the chasm in the process, Skywalker saved her, only to decapitate her as she recovered." Could you make it a bit more clear that his saving her was only for the purpose to ensure her death? As is, it's a bit confusing as to why he'd save her and then decapitate her.
 * In Legacy: link for the battle in which Seer died?
 * At some points you refer to Ship as an "it," and on at least one other occasion as a "he." I don't personally have a preference regarding which one you use, since canonical arguments could be made for both; I think it would just be best to be consistent within the article.
 * I'm not sure that the last two sentences of the Appearance subsection really fit there.
 * Is the attribution for the quote of the "Lumiya" subsection of Personality in the right order? Didn't Rar speak the first line? I'll continue with Interactions. Jonjedigrandmaster  ( Talk ) 19:58, January 27, 2012 (UTC)
 * Picking up with the BTS asap. Jonjedigrandmaster  ( Talk ) 16:02, January 31, 2012 (UTC)

Comments

 * Special thanks to, for providing much of the behind the scenes material. Tremendous thanks to , who provided a stellar copy edit and with zeal. This nomination is dedicated to , who initially began this project with me, but has since left the site to pursue other endeavors. Here's to you, my friend, thank you.  —Tommy  9281  Tuesday, July 12, 2011, 22:20 UTC 
 * Lumiya should be nominates as good article.--Nihilus 16:36, August 21, 2011 (UTC)
 * Menkooroo's pointed out that there's no obvious consensus on this (or that the consensus is perhaps against my opinion?), but in my view, Chewbacca on first mention should perhaps be called something else than simpy a "Wookiee." Everyone else in the text gets to be called by their rank or role, but he's only his species. Again, my view, and I do intend to start a SH thread about this eventually, but I wanted to bring it up at least as a comment. Continuing review slowly but surely. :) ~ Savage BOB sig.png 01:55, September 28, 2011 (UTC)
 * Addressed.  —Tommy  9281  Wednesday, September 28, 2011, 04:16 UTC 

Vote to strike objections by ID-21 Dolphin (Inq only)

 * 1) Objections have been addressed for more than three weeks.  1358  (Talk)  12:25, September 16, 2011 (UTC)
 * 2)  CC7567  (talk) 01:25, September 17, 2011 (UTC)
 * 3)  Cavalier One FarStar.svg( Squadron channel ) 14:13, September 20, 2011 (UTC)
 * 4) --  Darth Culator  (Talk) 17:38, October 8, 2011 (UTC)
 * 5) Grand Moff Tranner Imperial Department of Military Research.svg (Comlink) 03:34, October 9, 2011 (UTC)