Talk:Gray Jedi

Can someone expand on this article. I'm sure there are alot more to the grey jedi then what I provided. -Redemption 04:42, 7 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure we want this article. Gray Jedi is only used once in the entire EU, and its a pejorative statement Tyvokka utters to Plo Koon about why Qui-Gon Jinn is unsuitable to the council. QuentinGeorge 08:38, 16 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * In KOTOR 2, there is a set of robes called "Gray Jedi Robes". The description of these robes describe "Gray Jedi" as: "Gray Jedi, although having completed the teachings of the Jedi, operate idependently and outside of the Jedi Council. They are typically seen as misguided, though they have not necessarily succumbed to the dark side". So Gray Jedi are mentioned elsewere in the EU, though not described the way they are in the "Grey Jedi" article.70.109.226.104 16:54, 16 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * It does not, indeed, say they deny good and evil in the Force or otherwise. 68.225.242.19 00:40, 5 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Grey Jedi seem to be appearing more in the greater EU. Jacen Solo would certainly qualify in my opinion (though he I also think he's been showing some dark tendencies). Vergere would also qualify. So I believe we should keep it, but if we do, it should be expanded. -- SFH 20:06, 16 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * Neither is described as "grey", nor do they describe themselves as grey. QuentinGeorge 20:07, 16 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * Do they consider themselves light or dark? Do they consider themselves good or evil? Dot they&mdash;Good Lord! I'm starting to sound like a Potentium Heretic. I've got to stop reading NJO books before I go nuts. Still, does it really matter what they call themselves. I'm not saying they fit a concrete definition, but those are just a two. What of Jolee Bindo and Kreia? Jolee certainly thought in terms of grey. -- SFH 20:14, 16 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * All I'm saying is it's a very speculative article at the current time. I'd rather change it to be exclusively an examination of the term, and only include people who EXPLICTLY labelled themselves, or were labelled, as such. QuentinGeorge 05:17, 17 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * I will admit it is rather speculative, and in it's current form not very specific. But I think we should keep it. -- SFH 05:34, 17 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * I'm in the process of a rewrite for this article. Should have a better, less speculative version up soon. QuentinGeorge 04:53, 15 Dec 2005 (UTC)
 * Still planning on redoing this article. It's way too speculative and fanony at the moment. Give me a few days. QuentinGeorge 06:18, 26 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Thank you. It does seem to be a fanon description, given that it isn't used in canon sources at all, really--Erl 22:56, 27 March 2006 (UTC)
 * The term is used, sparingly and vaguely, in all the sources listed (I don't know about Traitor). But I think this article needs a major rewrite, it is very fanony and too poetic.  Maybe nominate for an improvement drive? Lonnyd 10:48, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
 * From what I've heard about Grey Jedi, they aren't really Jedi anymore. They weren't exiled, they just left the order.  I forget where I heard that though. MaulYoda 18:52, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

especially in light of the fact wikiQuote "Each clan had a unique set of rules regarding Force usage, but all the clans held one rule above all others: "Never concede to evil"."end wikiquote
 * The Gray Jedi and Gray Sith are realistic and should be canonized as such..I've already begun work on the fleshing out a divergent order...not the potentium mind you but one that is to be much older..it would be concealed due to its very nature in similar fashion Vergere could hide herself in the force.
 * From what I read of the NJO I don't consider Vergere a gray jedi by doctrine although she has become one in action and by fate of circumstance being that the order that she adheres to no longer exists except through Luke Skywalker whose authority she seems to outright reject...
 * Also in the Article about Jolee Bindo, he specifically refers to himself as gray and even is quoted asking Revan to think of him to the effect of being a normal person with a lightsaber and force abilities...
 * Kreias ultimate goal in her article is to end the dominance of the force and her fall to the path of the Sith prior to this would seem to me to make her more of a gray Sith than a gray Jedi. She was cast out of the Sith Order, she didn't quite return to the Jedi did she.
 * The Dathomir Witch clans would likely all qualify as gray except the Nightsisters who I guess would be Darkside...hmm but their universal law never concede to evil could be interpreted as a 0 tolerance creed for the light side of the force,but I wager that its simplicity makes it inadequate to serve this purpose.
 * Even Mace Windu (and perhaps many of his people as well by default)could have been argued to have been a gray by nature with his creation of Vapaad, jaunts into the dark side, and decision to kill Sidious though he was apparently bested in lightsaber duel."the question of justice still arises with this though: Is it evil to strike down an apparantly greater evil in ways that are against your adopted moral codes? When do those codes themselves become evil amid questionable circumstances?
 * Heres another candidate to the gray..-wikiquote-Over the next thirteen years, Lorian ditched the Agri-Corps and became the leader of a band of space raiders-..-Lorian in a way redeemed himself, and died in spirit as a true Jedi Knight-endwikiquote-..read about this dude and decide for yourself..I say gray..

So why should it matter if the characters have identified themselves or been identified as such...yet it WOULD be difficult to catagorize the characters based on whether they EVER defied the Jedi order or not or used the darkside for a light purpose. Actually I choose to believe despite anybody's argument even if it winds up being PURE FANON that there is or should be a loosely based (perhaps only bound merely by creed maybe a secretive order of force users who follow after the Exile..because I play the Exile in such a way as he never truly committed himself in any direction too far. And he definately had followers. A few simple conversations could sway my guy over to the light or darkside. I wager I can do this all the way until I'm ready to do the Korriban cave thing. Also both he/she and Revan's fates are pretty much unresolved, and they seem to dissappear into the Unknown Regions..Well anyway thats all I will say for now, feel free to edit and trim my article to suite the discussion..In the end without dedicated "gray" orders like the Potentium, it would logically fall on the observer's opinion to determine who is of the dark, who is of the light and who is of the gray.
 * I don't believe most of the gray jedi are in any actual gray order in and of themselves just as the Jedi order is not known as the Light Order(arguably the lack of Dark in front of the term Jedi implies this but its difficult since the Jedi Order existed before the Dark jedi or the Sith..btw I know we have all noticed in the games and articles the distinctions made between the Dark Jedi and the Sith..

Name
I hate to be the one to bring this up, but shouldn't this article be called "Gray Jedi?" That's how it is spelled in the only official source we have, and the manual of style tells us to use american spelling. Lonnyd 21:42, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
 * In this case, someone should make similar changes to the template and category.

Traits

 * Once again someone ladled a whole lot of fanon rubbish into this article just as I was trying to fix it. I have reverted it so I can have another go at fixing it. QuentinGeorge 13:29, 16 June 2006 (UTC)