Forum:Chosen One

If the Chosen One was to destroy the Sith then why are there still sith in the Legacy era. have I understood the prophecy? Anzati02 20:55, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
 * You are correct. The reason that there are Sith in the Legacy Era is because Lumyia, a dark jedi under Vader's tutelage, named herself a Sith after Anakin fulfilled the prophecy. If you think about it, Lumiya was never really a Sith. But for the sake of argument, the Force was brought into balance before a new sith order arose. Anyway, Lumiya took Jacen Solo as her apprentice, and it continued up to Darth Krayt and his apprentices. However, I myself have never really understood the prophecy. If the Chosen One was supposed to bring balance to the Force, shouldn't that mean that their should be an equal amount of Jedi and Sith, light and dark perfectly balanced?
 * AFAIK, there are no official interpretation of what 'Balance to the Force' means. GL seems to say that the destruction of Palpatine and Vader brings balance, but that stuff is dubious IMO. DarthMRN 00:17, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

But Anakin did NOT destroy the sith. Palpatine was killed by, was it Luke, Leia, or baby Anakin?Anzati02 00:20, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Ummm... he kinda did. He killed Palpatine to save his Luke, redeeming him. By destroying Palpatine, he also destroyed the Sith as well (at least, in the Galactic Civil War...) --FireV 00:24, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
 * The resurrections of Palpatine were, in my opinion, publicity stunts to get people to read the Dark Empire books. Seriously, this whole inhabiting clone after clone seems a little far-fetched. At any rate, I have to go with DarthMRN's interpretation on this one, and say that there really isn't a specific definition of what "balance of the force" is, so unless GL gives out a definition any time soon, we have to continue speculating. By the way, in answer to Anzati02's question, Han Solo shot and killed the ailing Palpatine, and Empatajayos Brand bound his dying essence to Palpatine's (basically) to prevent him from inhabiting another clone or innocent person. Hope that helps you all. Hobbes15 ( Tiger Headquarters ) 00:37, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Anakin destroyed them for a time. There were no Sith around for several minutes after Palpatine's death ;). Or, if you want the serious explanation, as usual GL didn't bother to check the EU before he added his prequel crap, and so his storylines don't make any sense in the broader context. Simple as that. Evir Daal 14:27, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
 * The Prequel series is not crap! The only reason GL made it was to explain the origonal series. A.K.A. Darth Vader and the Empire's rise to power.  Not to mention so of the coolest battle scenes ever. User:Fox2251
 * Please stay on topic. This thread is not about personal favorites. - Sikon 17:57, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Luke and Anakin brought the balance, but there are rumers of one Vader's apprentices, Darth GaligaNathan Solo
 * The Rule of Two, anyone? Even if Vader had an apprentice, which he technically does according to The Force Unleashed, they wouldn't officially be a Sith. At least I don't think so. Hobbes15 ( Tiger Headquarters ) 19:42, 27 May 2007 (UTC)
 * If Plagueis created Anakin like the rumours suggest then perhaps this would put the force out of balace and only when Anakin became a Sith and redeemed himself by dying did the force fall back into balance. As Yoda said the prophecy could have been misread as Sith applies to both plural and singular names. Its only a theory though Snap-hiss
 * The line of succession was broken. Lumiya's and Darth Krayt's "Sith" cannot be Sith at all since they are not in the same unbroken line of succession. As for why Lumiya wouldn't be a Sith if she were Vader's apprentice, it's the same deal with Asaaj Ventress, Quinlin Vos, Mara Jade, the "secret apprentice" from The Force Unleashed, and all of those other students who learned under Sidious, Tyranus and Vader: while they may have received training - and indeed, as in the case of Lumiya, even given much Sith knowledge - they were never ordained as Sith. It takes a Dark Lord to ordain a new Sith, as we see Palpatine ordain Anakin in Revenge of the Sith. It isn't just the knowledge imparted; that's maybe half of it: it's the ordination. Lumiya and the Sith after her were never ordained by a Sith Lord of the original lineage, but were rather self-proclaimed. The line was severed, and so they could not have possibly come from the true line of Sith Lords.
 * That's a good assumption, but Jacen Solo clearly becomes a Sith Lord like his grandfather, Anakin Skywalker. so perhaps Lumiya consulted knowledge from ancient Sith holocrons, and when she believed she was strong enough, proclaimed herself Dark Lady of the Sith, also, remember that Lumiya and Vergere were working together to corrupt Jacen, and that Lumiya does say that Vergere was a Sith apprentice of Sidious. How much of what Lumiya is saying is true is unknown, but it seems likely, considering that Vergere contradicts everything George Lucas says that the Force is, however, Sidious lied through his teeth to corrupt Anakin.--Jedi Kasra 23:16, 28 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Lumiya was never ordained by a Sith Lord, and neither was Vergere. Vergere would never have had time to have been Sidious' Sith apprentice if you look at the timeline; and since Sidious believed very strongly in the Rule of Two, I doubt he would have broken it. The most Vergere could have ever been to him was exactly what Lumiya was to Vader: a Dark Jedi apprentice given much Sith training and knowledge, but never ordained an actual Sith. They could have read all the holocrons they wanted and proclaimed themselves Sith as much as they wanted, but without an ordination from a true Dark Lord of the Sith of the ancient, unbroken line stemming from the ancient exiled Dark Jedi and Sith species combined into one, they could never be Sith. Jacen may have been ordained by Lumiya in a similar fashion as his grandfather was years previous, but Lumiya herself never received such an ordination and thus was not adopting Jacen into anything, no matter what she believed. Whether they wanted to admit it or not, they were starting a new line of Sith who were entirely unconnected to the true line, and thus not true Sith. (Now I know that someone will inevitably bring up the fact that that line had seemingly been broken many times in Sith history. I can explain away that one as well, but I'll save it for another time.)
 * No no, do go on. --School of Thrawn 101 05:14, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I concur. How do you explain away that the Sith has died and then been resurrected several times, and still deny Lumiya the legitimacy required to use her Sith knowledge to restart the Order in absence of a old style Sith master? It is just a name, after all. Who decides legitimacy if all old Sith are dead? Even Vader & Palpatine could trace their roots back to Kaan's Sith order, which was IIRC started by a Jedi, no less, after a hiatus of ca. 2000 years! DarthMRN 08:06, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Marka Ragnos, I'll sure you'll agree, was a member of the Old Sith Empire, and was a Dark Lord. His spirit ordained Exar Kun and Ulic Qel-Droma. They were ordained by a true Sith Lord, so they became part of the same Sith Order as the old Empire was a part of. (Plus, Naga Sadow ordained Freedon Nadd, for what it's worth, but that line never really went anywhere.) These Sith, probably from Kun's line, were still in existence and scattered at the time of Revan. He found and unified these Sith. They must have had a Dark Lord as well, for only a Dark Lord could have ordained Revan and Malak into the Sith. This Dark Lord was either very benign and gave up the throne to Revan, convinced of his leadership skills, or Revan simply slew him and took it from him. This line survived until the Sith Triumvirate, of which at least one Sith known as the "Unknown Darth" survived and continued the lineage until the time of Darth Ruin. This one Sith, being the only one left, would naturally have been the Dark Lord, and passed on that title until Ruin came along. Ruin unified all of the scattered Sith organizations and would have received his ordination from this one Revanite line, and, like Revan, was either given the mantle of Dark Lord or took it from the existing one. And, as you know, this line continued until Bane, and then from Bane until Plagueis, Sidious, Maul, Tyranus and Vader, and which point it was finally cut off completely. This line began with the intermingling of Dark Jedi and Sith after the Hundred Year Darkness. It's not just a name: it is a legacy. A legacy that tipped the balance of the Force in the dark side's favor and had to be destroyed. So you see, the line was never broken. This is all based on facts provided by various media, all of which Wookieepedia mentions.
 * There are two unsubstantiated assumptions which breaks the argument of a single unbroken line. 1) How Revan became Sith has yet to be revealed. AFAIK there is nothing in canon to indicate he found scattered Sith and was ordained by them. All that is known is that he took the mantle of Dark Lord. 2) The link between the Unknown Darth and Darth Ruin is not verified anywhere I know of. If you can provide proof to the contrary, feel free to edit the Darth Ruin article. But if the article is any indication, he too took up the mantle on his own accord. Not saying you can't be right, especially with these True Sith lurking about, but going purely by canon, Lumiya is no worse than Revan or Ruin. At least we know she studied under a genuine Dark Lord. DarthMRN 22:36, 30 May 2007 (UTC)