Talk:Order 66/Legends

Should we add, either here or on the Great Jedi Purge page, a list of where/how certain Jedi die? --Fade 12:12, 27 May 2005 (UTC)
 * The Jedi that we're shown pale in comparison to the number that were actually killed in the order. Perhaps a categorization on the pages of Jedi that died that way would be easier. --SparqMan 13:11, 27 May 2005 (UTC)
 * Oh, yea, I know we only see a tiny amount, but we just include a sample using references from film or EU material (my brother has a comic of the film that shows Vos dying, for example) --Fade 14:44, 27 May 2005 (UTC)


 * How many, who, and how do all the jedi die in the temple?

Origin
If it was indeed Sifo-Dyas, not Dooku or Palpatine posing as him, who ordered the clone army, who was behind the implementation of Order 66? - Sikon [ Talk ] 06:36, 29 Oct 2005 (UTC)
 * Sifo-Dyas ordered it, but he was murdered and impersonated by Dooku, who instructed Jango Fett to train the troopers for an eventual Order 66. QuentinGeorge 06:42, 29 Oct 2005 (UTC)

66 or Purge?
Should Jedi killed by Vader really be listed as Order 66 Victims? Order 66 is carried out by the clone troopers, wheras Vader's victims should be listed as Purge deaths. Jocasta Nu, Cin Drallig, Bene, Whie and Serra Kato were all killed by Vader - Kwenn
 * Well, for some of these Jedi, we don't know if they were killed by clones or Vader, minus Nu, Drallig, and Kato, at least as far as I know. So, if we know that Vader killed them, then we should remove their names. Cmdr. J. Nebulax 21:04, 1 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * Also, Vader was leading a detachment tasked with carrying out Order 66. Just because he wasn't a trooper doesn't mean he wasn't carrying out the order as well.  jSarek 22:27, 1 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * That's true. Cmdr. J. Nebulax 22:58, 1 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * Well, they would be listed as victoms! Vader was killing them in the name of order 66. I can hardly see why there is an argument over this.
 * Perhaps the suvivors should be included with a small bit of text that explained how (if) they were eventually killed, to save people just looking through having to individually go through each article
 * That would be too much. And please don't restart old topics. Fleet Admiral J. Nebulax (Imperial Holovision) [[Image:Implogo.jpg|20px]] 14:35, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

Pre-programmed?
Are we sure the order itself was programmed into them? From what I've read (SW Insider) they had prior knowledge of the order's existance, but it wasn't ingraned into them. Shadowtrooper talk 01:18, 14 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * It wasn't pre-programmed. It's been confirmed by many (include Karen Traviss) to be just an ordinary "last-resort" order. The clones were conditioned to follow any orders, not just this specific one. If the article makes any suggestion that Order66 was "pre-programmed", it should be revised. QuentinGeorge 05:02, 14 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * Yes. I believe that I read somewhere that there were many other "last resort" orders that they knew of but did not use unless they were issued. Cmdr. J. Nebulax 20:45, 14 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * Battlefront II's narration seems to suggest that the clones of the 501st Legion (and possibly other legions) were well aware of what Order 66 entails, and know that it is a betrayal of the Jedi. They feel sympathy for Aayla Secura, whom they respect, and knowingly keep their intentions from Ki-Adi-Mundi - Kwenn
 * Battlefront isn't exactly great as a canon reference...anyway, the novelisation simply states that Cody responded as he'd been taught before he'd been born; "It will be done, my lord" and says he was a clone and would thus follow the order without "hesitation or regret". --Fade 18:50, 15 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * Well, the clones definitely knew about Order 66, but it wasn't pre-programmed into them. Cmdr. J. Nebulax 21:46, 15 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * If Order 66 wasn't pre-programed, why did the clone commanders all address Palpatine as My Lord? -- SFH 22:48, 18 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * Because he's the Supreme Chancellor? I don't see how "My Lord" automatically means they are pre-programmed. QuentinGeorge 23:51, 18 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * True, but the Supreme Chancellor was described as "Excellency". If they thought they were addressing a Sith, however, they may have been pre-programmed to respond to Palpatine in a manner that he thought was flattering. -- SFH 23:58, 18 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * Or, since they knew about the order, that could have been taught to them as their response to Palpatine. Of course, we only hear Cody (and Jag, I believe) say it. Cmdr. J. Nebulax 01:07, 19 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * And Gree also said it. -- SFH 01:24, 19 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * But, back to the matter of being pre-programmed, I say again, they knew about it, they were fully aware of it, but they didn't execute Order 66, which was like a last-case scenerio, under the Commander-in-Chief told them to execute it. Cmdr. J. Nebulax 12:38, 19 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * Break it up, you two! :) It was pre-programmed as a last resort order, or so I have read.

Origin of the name
Has anyone considered that the name "Order 66" may have come from the executive order issued by President Roosevelt that directed the interinment of Japanese Americans during World War II? The executive order was numbered 9066. This seems an even more likely theory of the symbolism behind the name then the more obvious theory that it comes from the Mark of the Best (though the two theories are not mutually exclusive). GL likes historic trivia, and seems to keep an eye to this, particularly with naming things. Since Executive Order 9066 was a directive to act against a group that was perceived erroneously to be enemies of the state, the parallel between it and Order 66 are non-trivial. --Jad Jermain Oh yeah, have you noticed on the complete list of wikicities, Pokemon is 666? I laughed. Hard.
 * We should al least include it in the Behind the scenes section. -- SFH 20:01, 20 Dec 2005 (UTC)
 * I agree. Admiral J. Nebulax 20:10, 20 Dec 2005 (UTC)
 * Already done Jad Jermain
 * Thank you. Admiral J. Nebulax 20:20, 21 Dec 2005 (UTC)
 * Mark of the best?!! Ha! You crack me up. But yeah, I see your point. (LOL)

Kill more than Jedi
Did Order 66 just involve Jedi? When the clone said "All these Wookies are dead", it look like some wookies building were burning, did the clones turn on the Wookies (after all, it did say Han meet Chewe when the big guy was being held by the Empire. Plus, before "Cody" left Utapau, it look like the Utapians in red were being captured. Double D 23:43, 30 Dec 2005 (UTC)
 * Order 66 was for Jedi; the clones then started to enforce the new Empire. They were two different events. Admiral J. Nebulax 02:05, 31 Dec 2005 (UTC)
 * There were no open hostilities against the Wookiees until a couple months later, according to Dark Lord. CooperTFN 01:20, 2 Jan 2006 (UTC)
 * Well, there were some hostilities against the Wookiees. In RotS, an AT-RT patrol finds a downed catamaran. The clone trooper's remark led me to believe they had started to hunt the Wookiees. Admiral J. Nebulax 01:23, 2 Jan 2006 (UTC)
 * I see what you mean, but that doesn't really prove they were fighting the wookiees. CooperTFN's right. All the clones left for several weeks, than invaded again, as depicted in Dark Lord: The Rise of Darth Vader. -LtNOWIS 01:32, 2 Jan 2006 (UTC)
 * I was just led to believe that the clones thought that the Wookiees were sheltering Yoda, and therefore, they attacked them. That's just what I got from it. Admiral J. Nebulax 12:19, 2 Jan 2006 (UTC)
 * There were at least three high-profile Jedi on Kashyyyk at the time (Yoda, Luminara and Quinlan, possibly Kai Justiss too) two of which managed to escape the initial betrayal. I guess the clones wouldn't care about burning down a few Wookiee homes to find their quarry. Also, the RotS comic adaptation depicts Wookiees attacking the clones to help Yoda escape, so it's likely that any who learned of the nature of Order 66 would want to avenge their Jedi friends - Kwenn
 * So, it's likely that the AT-RT patrol, if not the rest of the clone troopers, hunted down some Wookiees. Admiral J. Nebulax 12:32, 2 Jan 2006 (UTC)
 * I'm sure somewhere on the planet during Order 66 some Wookiee fought some Clone, but there is zero evidence indicating that that particular group killed those (or any) Wookiees. The leader wouldn't feel the need to inform the others that the Wookiees were dead unless they'd just found them. CooperTFN 18:40, 2 Jan 2006 (UTC)
 * "The leader wouldn't feel the need to inform the others that the Wookiees were dead unless they'd just found them". Actually, if they had been hunting them, the leader would have informed the others. Admiral J. Nebulax 20:28, 2 Jan 2006 (UTC)
 * In Battlefront II, a 501st member (narrator) in the battle of Kashyyyk said they left as heroes, and returned as conquerers. Therefore they must have had hostilities against the Wookiees, and made them slaves to the Empire as Han said. Also, if you look at Episode IV, Han and Luke use Chewbacca as a "prisoner" so they can get to the detention level. The Empire was acting extremely grudgingly to Chewy. Also see Battle of Kashyyyk (Imperial Era).
 * It is also very possible that the AT-RT patrol had seen the catamaran come down and just came to see if there were any survivors. And the clones were under the impression that Quinlan Vos had been killed; they just couldn't find the body. After all when a Juggernaut explodes underneath someone it is unlikely any identifiable remains would be left behind.
 * Please don't restart old topics. Fleet Admiral J. Nebulax (Imperial Holovision) [[Image:Implogo.jpg|20px]] 14:35, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

Not all the clones liked the order
Some of the clones where not happy with the order. they had no choice but to do it,a retired clone trooper from the 327th star corps, mentioned that after the battle on felucia,that non of his men could bare look ayla secura in the eyes. as the same soldier said about the following battle,it was indeed,the beggining of the end... Actually, as I recall, Cody's hesitation in the book consisted entirely of him wishing that Order 66 had been given before he gave Obi-Wan back his lightsaber. not exactly what I'd call true regret.
 * That's not why the clone trooper said it. Admiral J. Nebulax 21:53, 1 Jan 2006 (UTC)
 * It was a 501st Clone Trooper who couldn't look Secura in the eye because he thought they were traitors.Kalas Grengar 01:02, 21 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Yep. Climber
 * He couldnt look in her in the eyes because they were being called to kill all the Jedi, and a Jedi(Secura) just saved all of them. Also, Cody had a moment of hesitation when he was trying to kill ObiWan in the ROTS novel, and we dont know what bly, gree and bacara were thinking --Razzy1319 07:36, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Actually, the whole "the clones knew about Order 66" idea was only in Battlefront II, which goes against canon a lot, so let's not use game references. However, the Cody hesitation is different, as well as Climber. Admiral J. Nebulax (talk) 11:56, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Good point. I could image Cody finding Obi-Wan two years later and thinking "Damn you Palpatine, why couldn't you have issued Order 66 before I gave him his lightsaber..." Admiral J. Nebulax (Imperial Holovision) [[Image:Implogo.jpg|20px]] 19:43, 24 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Yep, it wasn't real regret, hes carrying out his orders, he just wished it was easier is all. Climber is the only case i know of? Jedi Dude 10:35, 6 August 2006 (UTC)
 * Climber is the only known one, yes. But please don't restart old topics. Fleet Admiral J. Nebulax (Imperial Holovision) [[Image:Implogo.jpg|20px]] 14:35, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

Suggestions for Improvement

 * Suggestions, request, and/or violent reactions?
 * Is copying wikipedia's Order 66 article be fine? --Razzy1319 07:05, 12 Jan 2006 (UTC)
 * Don't just replace this article with that one. Instead, integrate sections that we don't have. QuentinGeorge 07:44, 12 Jan 2006 (UTC)
 * But not word-for-word. Admiral J. Nebulax 20:33, 12 Jan 2006 (UTC)

Even Piell

 * It says within Piell's bio that he was killed in the Clone Wars. Is this a mistake?  If not, then his name should be removed from the list, as he was already dead by the time of Order 66. --AngelQueen 04:23, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

Pictures?

 * This article isn't that long. Isn't four pictures for it a bit much?  Opinions? --AngelQueen 05:42, 21 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Maybe, but at the very least we shouldn't add any more. -- SFH 05:45, 21 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Two pictures are enough. Admiral J. Nebulax 20:01, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

Unknown/MIA
I didn't want to just jump into an edit with this, but I think we might want to limit the Unknown list to Jedi that there's some noteworthy reason to suspect that they might have survived the order, like Depa Billaba's coma. Otherwise, there'd be dozens of Jedi to put in it, since technically, there are a bunch we haven't actually seen die. I think it's fairly safe to say that Even Piell and the Bear Clan, for instance, didn't make it. In fact, I've heard that Lucas' assumption is that the kids Anakin finds in the council chamber are the Bear Clan. CooperTFN 23:44, 21 January 2006 (UTC)
 * That's what I said a long time ago. But someone else didn't think so because there weren't any Noghri younglings or something like that. Of course, I did say perhaps he/she became a Padawan... Anyway, I'll remove it. Admiral J. Nebulax 23:48, 21 January 2006 (UTC)
 * and do we need that un-named surviors part, surely they can just go under the list of survivors, theres likely alot of Jedi (% wise i mean) who survived we don't know..i changed it to what i thought but the anon just put it back the way they had it :S Jedi Dude 23:51, 9 August 2006 (UTC)
 * I'm current integrating it into the "Known survivors" list. Fleet Admiral J. Nebulax (Imperial Holovision) [[Image:Implogo.jpg|20px]] 00:27, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

Adding Images
As was already discussed a little further up this page, two images is enough for an article this short. The only way I'm letting another pic on here is if you can come up with at least one paragraph (by which I mean at least as long as the "Palpatine sent word out" paragraph) worth of new text as well. That goes for any subsequent images, too. CooperTFN 20:36, 28 January 2006 (UTC)
 * No more images are needed. Admiral J. Nebulax 23:47, 28 January 2006 (UTC)

Battlebox
If you are going to use that box then include the Jedi as participants since they did participate in it (by fighting back)Phillowe88 19:34, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
 * I propose an infobox to be placed in. It would make a huge difference in the article, making it into a battle page. Bly1993 12:15, 30 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Go ahead. Admiral J. Nebulax 21:27, 30 January 2006 (UTC)
 * I believe this is a mistake. Order 66 was not a battle whatsoever. It was a command which initiated the Great Jedi Purge...and the Jedi Purge was a series of murders -- also not a battle. Now other battle boxes say things like "Previous Battle - Order 66". That doesn't make sense. Wolfdog 22:11, 4 February 2006 (UTC)
 * No, it isn't. It was a battle, no matter what. Jedi fought back. It happened around the same time across the Galaxy. Therefore, battlebox has been restored. Admiral J. Nebulax 01:43, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Alright then, as long as no other site calls it this. Wolfdog 02:50, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Why would it matter? Admiral J. Nebulax 20:38, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree with Wolfdog. It involved the battles of Mygeeto, Felucia, Kashyyyk, etc, etc, but a battle is a single engagement, not a single order happening all over the place at once. Besides which, attempting to list all the forces involved is impossible, attemping to set a timeline placement amongst the battles during which it occurred even moreso. It's like trying to determine whether Alderaan was destroyed before or after ANH. CooperTFN 02:04, 11 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Well, the timeline weirdness applies to all Episode 3 battles, I think. But I agree with Cooper and Wolfdog, a battle template isn't useful. A unique, non-template infobox might be appropriate.-LtNOWIS 02:17, 11 February 2006 (UTC)
 * "A unique, non template infobox might be appropriate". What do you suggest? Admiral J. Nebulax 12:35, 11 February 2006 (UTC)
 * I suggest getting rid of the box altogether. "Battles" have the word "battle", "skirmish", etc. in them. Order 66 is well, an order. There is no one battle under the Order, and certainly not one self-titled "Order 66" Wolfdog 03:31, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
 * I'm not opposed to any kind of box, just a "battle" one. Maybe there should be an "Event" box...that would cover O66 as well as things like the destruction of Alderaan, Ghorman Massacre, Ruusan Reformations, etc. It could have largely the same info as a battle box, but without depending on a single location or moment. CooperTFN 05:06, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Wolfdog, do you even realize that some Jedi fought back, making it more of a battle than just a simple order? Admiral J. Nebulax 13:04, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Two people fighting each other does not make a battle. Some people fought back during the LA riots, yet that was not the Battle of LA. CooperTFN 17:43, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Yet this was a major event in galactic history. Admiral J. Nebulax 17:57, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes. Event. Do we call the destruction of Alderaan the Battle of Alderaan? I think the creation of an event box would be perfect for this issue. CooperTFN 18:02, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Alderaan never fought back so it wouldn't be much of a battle. Or did i miss ships attacking the Death Star? Phillowe88 18:30, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
 * I repeat: fighting does not make something a battle. Significance does not make something a battle. Are we just gonna go around and around on this? CooperTFN 18:48, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Then what by your view is a battle? A battle is when two or more parties fight each other for something Phillowe88 19:00, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Ah forget it. We could debate this till the world ends and still not get a clear view. Phillowe88 19:01, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Welcome to the internet. Do you (or Jack, if you're done debating) consider this a battle? CooperTFN 19:04, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
 * That is a fight. A battle is little more than a large scale fight. The point is when two opposing sides fight that is what is called a battle. Doesn't matter where or who. Two gangs fight, thats a battle. Two people fight, thats a small battle.Phillowe88 19:23, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Ok you win. That looks fine to me Phillowe88 19:39, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
 * This looks good now. Admiral J. Nebulax 20:35, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Well, it WAS and wasn't a battle. It was held all across the galaxy, so it wasn't a battle. It was between two (or more) sides, good and evil, Jedi CIS and Empire, so it was a battle. It was neither. K?
 * Here's my take on it. Order 66 was, clearly, not a battle, anymore than Order 65, Order 37, Order 102...all Order 66 is is an order. There has been a Jedi rebellion act as you see fit (I believe, I do not have a source having heard it on a forum). The article should be renamed or split. The battle/event was the execution of Order 66. The Order 66 article should just state what Order 66 is, and link to the battle-event.
 * Uh, Order 66 was an event in addition to an order. It was never called "Execution of Order 66", just Order 66. Admiral J. Nebulax (talk) 20:56, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

Just moved Zonder to the other side of list of Jedi that survived for neatness. Just a bit obsessive compulsive about that sort of thing, so I hope that is ok.
 * It's alphabetical order. That won't work. Fleet Admiral J. Nebulax (Imperial Holovision) [[Image:Implogo.jpg|20px]] 12:24, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

More than 100 lived

 * I'm questioning the quote stating that less than 100 jedi survived order 66.

The recent flow of survivors including those who have either not been named (ex. Verpine jedi, Death star prisoner) and those who have only been referenced (ex. naboo rebellion jedi, Qu Rahn's group) have strongly been suggesting that the list is going into at Least over 120 survivors
 * I agree. However, it's a quote, and we can't change quotes. Fleet Admiral J. Nebulax (Imperial Holovision) (Data file) [[Image:Implogo.jpg|20px]] 22:16, 18 August 2006 (UTC)
 * Never mind; it's not an actual quote. Fleet Admiral J. Nebulax (Imperial Holovision) (Data file) [[Image:Implogo.jpg|20px]] 22:16, 18 August 2006 (UTC)
 * I've made a little addition to the section that explains your conclusion. Fleet Admiral J. Nebulax (Imperial Holovision) (Data file) [[Image:Implogo.jpg|20px]] 22:18, 18 August 2006 (UTC)

Effectiveness of the order
Sure it got rid of most of the jedi, but it left 150 or so survivors. I used to think the order was extremely sucessful after watching ROTS and reading the comics of the first dozen or so survivors.
 * Was the order as sucessful as it shoud have been?

But now the survivors are going over 100 with more survivors being revealed with upcoming games,comics and books. Sure its fun to learn about all of these survivors, but why don't they just use the survivors they already have introduced instead of making new ones for each new book and comic? Afterall, most of the survivors are on a To Be Continued note anyway.

The list is just starting to get a little too big is all i'm really saying.
 * To answer your question: Remember that many Jedi were not commanding clone troopers, and some got very lucky. Also, if the list gets too much longer, a category like Category:Order 66 survivors can be created, and maybe even a Category:Order 66 victims, Category:Great Jedi Purge victims, and Category:Great Jedi Purge survivors. Fleet Admiral J. Nebulax (Imperial Holovision) (Data file) [[Image:Implogo.jpg|20px]] 22:47, 18 August 2006 (UTC)


 * And remember despite all these Jedi were seeing who survive, thousands died, theres gonna be barely a hundred or just over alive, so its not that un-realistic Jedi Dude 22:52, 18 August 2006 (UTC)
 * 100 surviving out of an order of 10,000 means a 99% kill rate. That's effective. QuentinGeorge 23:08, 18 August 2006 (UTC)
 * exactly, the actural figure was 99.9% killed so i'd say well done to the clones, the surviving Jedi stories will always be interesting because there so...lucky? I think a order 66 survivor article will be useful, i'll make it tommorow. Jedi Dude 23:14, 18 August 2006 (UTC)
 * Is one really needed? Fleet Admiral J. Nebulax (Imperial Holovision) (Data file) [[Image:Implogo.jpg|20px]] 00:47, 19 August 2006 (UTC)
 * Since that article was basically the same as the list here, I redirected that article to the "Known survivors" list. Fleet Admiral J. Nebulax (Imperial Holovision) (Data file) [[Image:Implogo.jpg|20px]] 00:53, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

Unknown names

 * On various sites and in forums, people keep on suggesting jedi survivors. Most are ill founded or ridiculous such as Morgan Katarn or Aalya Secura. But some names keep on popping up.

Does anybody know who Xavier Dade and Idnum-Ki are?
 * They sound like fanon. Fleet Admiral J. Nebulax (Imperial Holovision) [[Image:Implogo.jpg|20px]] 00:56, 2 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Idnum-Ki is on wikipedia but Xavier Dade has popped up on almost evey forum I've seen.
 * Just a word of advice: Wikipedia is not a source. Fleet Admiral J. Nebulax (Imperial Holovision) [[Image:Implogo.jpg|20px]] 14:47, 2 September 2006 (UTC)


 * I know but I was wondering if the name had any connection to the Star Wars universe.