Talk:Jar'Kai/Legends

Would Darth Maul and Exar Kun's lightsaber styles be similar to Jar'Kai, or is it some other form?
 * Darth Maul used a variant of Juyo, it is mentioned in the Juyo article, I think. As for Exar Kun, I have no idea, I hardly know anything about the era before the movies. I suppose Jar'Kai had connections with double-bladed saber fighting, as both dual sabers and "Sith lightsabers" required harmony between your two hands. - TopAce 22:01, 27 January 2006 (UTC)
 * niman/jarkai seems to imply more than one blade so why not?

Jar'Kai name origin
Jar'Kai seems to be the name of an emperor: in X-Wing Alliance, one of the trophy is a pair of Duelling Swords obtained by the Azameen family from a certain "Jar'Kai" emperor...
 * It's use as a name for a lightsaber form is from here. jSarek 02:18, 19 Oct 2005 (UTC)
 * OK.From the article you mention, I note this: "...the Yovshin Swordsmen of the Atrisian Empire, who wielded a dueling sword in each hand, dubbing the weapons "Jar'Kai" after the Kitel Phard city where.....". So, I guess we can admit the name Jar'Kai in X-Wing Alliance refers to the city's emperor. --Isharfoxat 00:07, 21 Oct 2005 (UTC)
 * Remember that the lightsaber forms were introduced AFTER X-wing Alliance was released. - TopAce 22:01, 27 January 2006 (UTC)

Appearances and sources
I've created an Appearances section which is probably far from exhaustive, so please add whatever titles you can think of, in which this form appears.

Someone created a sources section. I don't know if we should keep it, since the article provides a link to lightsaber combat for sources. Also, I'm not sure that there's anything on this form of combat in X-Wing alliance - at least I don't remember that being the case KEJ 17:42, 14 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * But I do remember those two swords mentioned, now that I think about it KEJ 17:46, 14 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * Just as TopAce said, "named" lightsaber fighting style were introduced after the release of X-Wing Alliance. In the game, the swords originally belonged to a certain Jar'Kai emperor. As I said, this form may have been inspired by a blade weapon fighting style from -let's suppose- Kitel Phard city, which could have been ruled by the Jar'Kai dynasty --Isharfoxat 14:08, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

Revan
Why is Revan listed twice?


 * Why is he listed at all? In Kotor he uses a single blade when he was a sith --Dumac 23:01, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Check the lightsaber combat style section of Revan's article. Unless you can prove that Revan knew 0% about Jar'Kai, his vision-appearance in KOTOR2 was still canon. Sora Bulq used 1 saber in EP2 too. Darth Kevinmhk 02:48, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

Anakin Skywalker Pic
Do you think we can get a pic of Anakin Skywalker utilising the Form on here? Whenever there's an opportunity to demonstrate something's use in one of the films with a picture, I think it should be done... but maybe that's just me. (Ulicus 00:37, 17 February 2006 (UTC))

The question is, was he using Jar'Kai or just using two sabers? Did he specifically train in the technique? The Force may guide a user in using two weapons, but the specific techniques would need to be learned, otherwise what's the point of having different forms?


 * He was using Jar'Kai version of Ataru in EP2, confirmed by Insider 66 Darth Kevinmhk 10:19, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
 * I already mentioned it in Anakin Skywalker's application on Geonosis was actually based on Form IV swordplay. Because neither Jar'Kai tactic nor Form IV swordplay was the young Jedi's mostly trained style, Count Dooku was able to break through Anakin's array of weapons easily. Darth Kevinmhk 10:21, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

Jedi Katana

 * What is Jedi Katana?
 * Do you mean Jedi katana?  Michaeldsuarez  [[Image:Infinite_Empire.png|10px]] ( Activate Holocron ) 00:29, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Form X?

 * I'm sure the names Niman / Jar'Kai have numerous canonical sources to support, but where does "Form X" come from? The article should be moved unless the number was sourced, just like Sokan is now just "Sokan". Darth Kevinmhk 06:50, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
 * I Agree. In the heroes Guide Web Enhancement where they were first named there was no mention of them being Form VIII, IX or X.Grunny 09:53, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Do two sabers always equal Jar'Kai/Niman?
I noticed that Jedi Knight, Jedi Academy, and both Knights of the Old Republic games are listed as appearances for this form, but all that really appears in the games is the presence of two lightsabers. In fact, Knights of the Old Republic II specifically has lightsaber forms, and the forms are used regardless of whether the wielder has one blade, a double-blade, or two sabers... there is no Jar'Kai, and the Niman is the other one. Jedi Knight is noted as the first appearance, but all that appears here is crazy Boc with his unorthodox form of jumping around with two lightsabers; his connection with the technique was not described until the novella came out. My main question is, is Jar'Kai/Niman the ONLY possible form of dual saber combat? Has it been stated that Jar'Kai and Niman (this version) are even the same forms (if their separate descriptions are identical, then that would work too)? Another thing I wonder is how many of the "Appearances" listed specifically name Jar'Kai, how many of them specifically name "Niman", and how many just depict a Jedi with two sabers. -BaronGrackle 22:15, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Well, from all the available sources, Jar'Kai (named by at least The New Essential Guide to Characters in Darth Maul's entry) and Niman (Dual blades version Niman was named in Hero's Guide web enhancement) both described the same thing: dual sabers combat. Unless we can find a source which really indicates they are different, I see no reason to split them apart. About practitioners: Well, Maul was named as Jar'Kai practitioner, and people like Sora, Asajj, Vosa, Keto, Hett, Krayt, Kavar who used dual blades so often and so good that they should have some formal training on them. Darth Kevinmhk 15:15, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
 * I suppose that's fair enough; a Force Push is a Force Push, regardless of whether they call it such, and the same would apply here. So is the Jedi Knight game really the first appearance of a two-lightsaber character? If so... I mean, I'm almost proud to be a gamer. :-) -BaronGrackle 20:18, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
 * So using two sabers means you are using Jar'Kai? Weird The Pure 501st 15:06, 7 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't think two sabers always means you use Jar'Kai, does that mean Anakin is using Jar'Kai when he beheads Darth Tyranus? Just because Mace WIndu used his and Depa's lightsabers to destroy three tanks on Haruun Kal does not imply any use of Jar'Kai. Technically, to be a Jar'kai master in both K.O.T.O.R. games, you have to have Two-Weapon Fighting, Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, and Master Two-Weapon Fighting. So if I have Master Dueling, does that mean I still am using Jar'Kai when I use my ordinary lightsaber and a shoto against the Sand People? I don't think so.--Jedi Kasra 17:05, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Kol Skywalker
Now this has been going on for a while, but I would like to ask if Jar'Kai was transfered to the New Jedi Order because it says that Kol Skywalker was a Practicioner of Jar'Kai. And also was any form transfered to the New Jedi Order. Derek Yoda&#39;s friend 02:56, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
 * It seems that anytime you pick up two lightsabers, you're using Jar'Kai. So yes, it was used in the New Jedi Order time period, but it's not as if there was anything specific to transfer. -BaronGrackle 22:14, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

Anakin never used Jar'kai
The Fightsaber article in Insider 62 says "Anakin's overconvidence in his own abilities causes him to break out of his usual Form V routine and engage Dooku with the two lightsaber variant of Form IV" So Anakin wasn't using Jar'kai, he was using a two saber variant of Ataru. 151.203.157.175 22:03, 27 May 2007 (UTC)
 * In the article it says: "The application of Jar'Kai often exists as a tactic instead of a completely independent style. Mace Windu, Depa Billaba, and Sora Bulq were still applying Vaapad when they fought with two swords. Anakin Skywalker's application on Geonosis was actually based on Form IV swordplay. Because neither Jar'Kai tactic nor Form IV swordplay was the young Jedi's mostly trained style, Count Dooku was easily able to break through Anakin's array of weapons." This means that Jar'kai is a two lightsaber variant of all lightsaber style's and that Anakin was using Jar'Kai. --Jedimca0 (Do or Do Not, There is No Try) 22:37, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

Mace never used Jar'Kai

 * Anakin used Jar'Kai, but Mace Windu and Depa Billaba used two swords, not Jar'Kai, they were using full Vaapad, two swords do not always mean Jar'Kai, if you pick up two swords and do something like chop someone's head off, it doesn't mean you're automatically using Jar'Kai, read my comment under 'Do two sabers always equal Jar'Kai/Niman'.--Jedi Kasra 00:18, 1 June 2007 (UTC)
 * They may not have been using the Jar'Kai style, but they were using the Jar'Kai tactic. Darth Vatrir


 * Well, the tactic is different from the the style, but they still weren't using Jar'Kai. Mace just took out three tanks, and Depa Billaba sliced her way in a gunship killing everybody inside.--Jedi Kasra 20:59, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Quinlan Vos and Jar'Kai
Where is a source for Quinlan Vos being a practioner of Jar'Kai? First of all, using two lightsabers does not indicate usage or mastery of Jar'Kai. Secondly, is there a comic that shows Vos using two sabers? Unless there is, I'm moving him to the possible practioners instead of concrete practitioners, if that's alright with you guys.--Jedi Kasra 21:01, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

Work
This article seems to be dominated by lists and galleries. There is also a lack of source links. This doesn't seem to conform to wiki style. Thank you (- -) 22:10, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Aayla Secura
The beautiful Aayla could benefit this article if we added a screenshot from Battlefront II where she is wielding two lightsabers. Gustafar 18:23, 14 August 2007 (UTC)


 * That's a good idea, Gustafar.--Jedi Kasra 20:53, 14 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Does someone has the game installed? I could reinstall but it'd be better if someone already had it. Gustafar 17:02, 16 August 2007 (UTC)