Talk:Jedi Guardian/Archive1

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Request
I would like to request that those whose KotOR 1 does not crash insert the short description said by Dorak to the top of the article for each class. Thanks.TopAce, 12:30 31 Oct 2005, GMT +1

Obi-Wan
...concentrated on martial training and combat and usually engaged in combat more than any other Jedi...

Um...doesn't this make Obi-Wan the very antithesis of a Guardian? He wasn't called "the Negotiator" for slaughtering people. The novel makes it abundantly clear that he would rather not fight at all. On top of that, (in the novel) he relies extremely heavily on the Force rather than physical talent to achieve his goals, to the point where he is just barely Obi-Wan when he fights. --Fade 16:34, 16 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * Well, as said on the page, the Roleplaying Game Core Rulebook lists Obi-Wan as a Guardian, so I guess he would have to be one.TIEPilot051999 17:07, 16 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * Does it refer to a certain Obi-Wan? As in, the one from TPM? Because that sort of makes a little more sense. If it is the case, a mention should be made, I think, because Obi-Wan doesn't serve as even a decent example of a Warrior Master in his later years. --Fade 21:03, 16 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * It's behind the scenes, and is exclusively talking about Obi-Wan being an "Jedi Guardian" in the RPG terms. QuentinGeorge 05:15, 17 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * Why isn't Obi-Wan a good example to a Warrior Master? He defeated the Chosen One and Grievous. That the did not prefer combat over negotiations is a matter of attitude. He was still a formidable swordsman despite this. Speaking of this connection between preference of combat and fencing skills, the starwars.com databank says that Mace Windu also prefered diplomacy over combat, and he still WAS a Warrior Master. - TopAce 10:48, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
 * If negotitations dont work, you have to fight70.71.210.205 02:12, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

List?
Now that Sage Master has a list, shall I(we, if I am too slow) add a list to Warrior Master as well?
 * Nobody stops you from adding a list of confirmed Warrior Masters, but for Jedi Guardians, I think we should wait until it's canonized. - Sikon [ Talk ] 12:54, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Wait... so Warrior Master and Jedi Guardian are two different terms? The article says they are the same. - TopAce 12:56, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Kyle Katarn is a Guardian too.

What class was Dooku?
Someone brought up Dooku on the article page's edit summary. I don't remember what class he was because I only learned about the three Jedi classes after getting KOTOR, which was almost a year after watching ROTS. --68.102.193.78 21:10, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Classes are largely relegated to the RPG; they're not neccessarily applied to all characters. Basically, in movie terms, there's just Padawan, Jedi Knight and Jedi Master. The point I was trying to make was that not all Jedi fall to the dark side simply because they unleash their anger or blood-lust in battle. Some decide to turn in the (mistaken) belief they can use their power for the good of the galaxy (or, in the case of Vader, their own, personal galaxy) - Kwenn 21:12, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
 * classes aren't generally true all the time, people say Yoda is a counciler etc because as the grand master its obvious hes a sage, Dooku himself is an exceptional fiher, but he has also got great knowlage of the force, so perhaps by RPG standars hes the middle class. Perhaps...............Jedi Dude
 * Dooku, per the RPG, is a Guardian. QuentinGeorge 06:27, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

Luke a Guardian?
Luke was on the consular list for a while I thought he was like yoda the best of his time with a lightsaber but even better with the force. what makes him a guardian?
 * I'm wondering the same thing. This is a new one to me.Someone please cite a source.--Master Dakari 03:39, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

what is the source that says luke is a Guardian?Tonyman1989 16:49, 16 July 2007 (UTC)tonyman1989

Strange (possibly subconscious) Conspiracy

 * Due to a strange feeling I had, I looked through the articles of every Jedi confirmed to have a specific class. I always thought that green somewhat corresponded to Consulars even before KotOR, starting with the introduction of green saber (which was actually meant to be blue) in ROTJ, and blue somewhat corresponded to Guardians, such as Luke in ESB and Kyle Katarn in Jedi Outcast. So I went throught the Jedi listed as Consulars or Guardian to see what saber colors they wielded. I only counted those who either wielded green or blue in a verified canonical source post-Attack of the Clones. (I ignored those of the New Jedi Order, as they appeared with several different colors; as well as those that appear with a color not green or blue in TPM comics; those who have been seen with more than one color, such as Adi Gallia; and those which have never appeared with a saber in a canonical source, such as Yarrel Poof)I found only four Jedi that contradict that theory: Consulars Cay and Ulic Qel-Droma and Shaak Ti, and Guardian Oppo Rancisis. Only four - there are dozens others that support it. I find it even more intruiging that the green lightsaber was never meant to exist, yet even pre-Kotor it seems to represent Jedi that specialize in the Force (such as Qhi-Gon Jinn, Luke post-ROTJ, and Yoda), and that blue seems to denote specialty in battle (such as Obi-Wan Kenobi, Luke pre-ROTJ, and Kyle Katarn). Anyway, I think that this should at least be mentioned in the article, as postKotOR sources have used this systme as canon (KotOR comics, for example). Well, that's about it. I posted this on Talk:Jedi Consular as well.  Bredd13 comlinkRepublic_Emblem.svg 05:18, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
 * I believe half of the list was added just based on lightsaber color. - TopAce 10:58, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Personally, I don't think any names should be in the list unless the individual Jedi's class is listed in a source. And since when was Gui-Gon a Jedi Guardian? He is a Consular, is he not?--Master Dakari 03:43, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
 * The correspondence between lightsaber colors and Jedi classes was never canon. It wasn't used or referenced in any way in KOTOR II, and even the first game never forced you or your companions to wield any specific color. Sikon 17:04, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Why is Asajj Ventress on the list of JEDI guardians? She was never in anyway a Jedi. I'm taking her off and moving her to the Sith Warrior list. - TikimanFiregod:68.114.160.188 05:08, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

Atris's place
I see Atris has been removed since no clear, irrefutable source has listed her as a Guardian. Should she be in a separate section of potentials, since the Old Republic "Jedi Guardian" sculpt is identical to her? Or should we consider her mention in Behind the Scenes to be sufficient? -BaronGrackle 15:41, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Lucien and Barrison
It isn't mentioned anywhere that those two were Guardians. - Sikon 17:01, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

New Picture
I think we should probably put in a new image for the Guardian Page. Maybe this one. Thoughts? Jedi master Rimsek  Chiss_Ascendancy.svg My rantings 23:22, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

Weapon Master
Whoever thinks that it's funny to keep changing Warrior Master to Weapon Master had better stop or I'll be forced to report you. Weapon Masters are an advanced form of Jedi Guardian, not the Master-level equivalent. Jedi Wolf 10:15, 13 March 2007 (UTC) *Um... I'm pretty sure they are. You can choose to become a weapon master, watchman, or a master. Doesn't that mean that they're the same rank? At least in KotOR II? Jedi master Rimsek  Chiss_Ascendancy.svg My rantings 17:56, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * By the way, I'm not the one editing it. I'm just a concerned citizen. Jedi master Rimsek   Chiss_Ascendancy.svg My rantings 18:06, 14 March 2007 (UTC) Sorry for being an idiot and not reading the Behind the Scenes thing. My bad.  Jedi master Rimsek   Chiss_Ascendancy.svg My rantings 18:15, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Darth Sion
Shouldn't Darth Sion be put on the list of Jedi Guardians? I know that Force Jump is just a game mechanic, but Sion does it anyway if you are locked in combat with him in the Trayus Academy and you run far enough away.--Jedi Kasra 19:22, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

The Great Jedi Guardian Purge
Per the discussion here, this list needs to be cut way the hell down. I'm tagging it to further illustrate my point. We need more than a lightsaber color and a WOTC stat to justify someone's placement here.  Gonk  ( Gonk! ) 14:18, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree, there's just way too many Guardians on this list, if I remember correctly, weren't Shoaneb Culu and Dace Diath on the 'Jedi Sentinel' article? Might I suggest putting only the notable Guardians on the list, like Mace Windu, Anakin, Obi-Wan, Juhani, Malak, etc., and having a redirect to a complete list of Guardians?--Jedi Kasra 19:43, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Brianna
Should she be on this list? We do not know if she travelled with the Jedi Exile and got trained as a Jedi. If you follow the canon story, she stays with Atris in the Jedi Academy on Telos IV and does not get trained in the ways of the Force, let alone become a Jedi Guardian.

Lucien
Why isn't Lucien mentioned isn't he a jedi guardian?--The K.O. King 22:37, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Malak
Shouldn't we call him Alek Longandunbearablename instead of Malak? Being a Jedi Guardian means being a Jedi, and Malak was Alek's sith name.Lykanthrope 15:14, 5 January 2008 (UTC)

NO less skilled at diplomacy?
I would think they should be a little less skilled at diplomacy, if they focused most of their training on combat.

Just because you are a guardian does not mean you can't be skilled in diplomacy. There is no rule or code. Every Jedi does his own thing.Revan Acolyte88 01:10, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Guardians are usually less skilled at diplomacy not through any fault of their own but because they rarely practice it.

Kit Fisto
Kit Fisto is on the Guardian list and Consular list. Which is it?Jdubbz 19:36, 28 February 2009 (UTC)
 * I checked the source, Power of the Jedi Sourcebook. He's a Consular. -LtNOWIS 19:43, 1 March 2009 (UTC)

Galen Marek
Galen ( Starkiller ) Was not a guardian?