Talk:Galactic Civil War/Legends

The main picture
I think it's silly to have the main picture of the article a cut down of the cover of Battlefront. It's just idiotic Anakin Thomas 07:26, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

A good guide for this article might be the style of the World War II article on Wikipedia. We need not describe each detail of every event (links to those descriptions on other article suffice), but we do need a better overall picture of the struggle, especially the post-Endor era. --SparqMan 00:41, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Well, you have to realize that the most important events of the war center around what happens concerning Luke Skywalker and Leia Organa. So obviously some backstory will be necessary.--Naryathegreat 02:44, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Of course, but this article should probably be used to tie together the articles on known on-goings of the Rebel Alliance and other rebel groups, rather than a summary of Episodes IV, V and VI. --SparqMan 02:57, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * What is the policy of Star Wars Wiki with the creation of user made maps for the use in articles such as this? That is something that made the WWII article so much more relevent; the use of maps. I wonder if we could draw up a map of Imperial / Rebel fleet movements, et al. using the map found on the Star Wars galaxy article and correlating information with other EU sources (such as Star Wars: X-wing, Star Wars: TIE Fighter, X-Wing Alliance, Shadows of the Empire, Star Wars: Dark Forces, and other material which depict events during the GCW. Another point which I noticed on the WWII page was how the home fronts were handling the war; we could do something similar where we describe how certain important planets and sectors fare during the GCW. It's quite a daunting task, but I think that if we were able to come up with a good list of good EU sources, then we may be on the right track. -- Falmarin 20:03, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Yes quite daunting. First we have to know where everything is, by using those maps (Nav-computer.com's is much more detailed). But this is no walk in the park to chart the fleet travels. Europe was only so big. Here we are talking about the area of a few thousand light years in a series of engagements. -- Riffsyphon1024 20:09, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * How acuurate is Nav-computer.com's map; I remember a canon map which looked similar to it, although it was no where near as detailed. Is the Nav-computer.com's map a composite of different canon maps? Also, trying to figure out which engagements are important enough to include in the article will be quite hard. I've personally ordered a batch of the Star Wars Empire (comics) to get a larger picture of what was going on during the GCW. I'm also planning on playing through Star Wars: X-wing and recording system names, events, etc. -- Falmarin 19:35, 23 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * The Nav-computer map is quite accurate. Yes, it's a composite of canon maps, with the addition of planets whose positions were described well enough in text references to locate - typically, these are mapped in grey instead of blue, though there are exceptions to that rule if the planet's position was decribed very precisely (e.g. Vandelhelm). jSarek 21:42, 6 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * You don't have to play all the game missions. Try to find a pilot file of the completed game, and just browse through the historical mission briefings. Star Wars: TIE Fighter will be difficult though, since you can't see the debreifings. Moff Rebus 22:48, 6 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Start of the Galactic Civil War
Look at the Galactic Civil War article on Wikipedia, the war began with the Great Jedi Purge during the rise of the Empire in 19 BBY, it did not began with the formation of the Rebel Alliance in 1 BBY. The Purge should not be considered as a separate conflict. If you don't believe me, look up at the Wikipedia:Talk:Galactic Civil War. -- Eddyward Telerionus 17:33, 6 Aug 2005 (UTC) But, still on the Wikipedia version of the talk page, it says that the events of the prequel trilogy set the stage for the war. The war began in 19 and 1 BBY and ended in 19 ABY. There's nothing wrong with the Wikipedia version of the article. -- Eddyward Telerionus 23:35, 7 Aug 2005 (UTC) It is probably best to acknowledge that while no one point in time can identified to mark beginning of the Galactic Civil War, independent skirmishes and guerilla wars began in X BBY with hostilities accelerating into the formation of major resistance networks in Y BBY that eventually coalesced into the Rebel Alliance, which declared itself and its supporters in open rebellion, in Z BBY. --SparqMan 06:23, 8 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * I looked at that page, and the argument *against* your view presented there seemed far more convincing; just because one anon decided to make a revert doesn't mean the decision was finalized. It's rather clear to me that the GCW didn't begin until organized, unified armed resistance to the Empire sprung up, and that didn't happen until the Corellian Treaty and the formation of the Alliance to Restore the Republic. jSarek 21:34, 6 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * I say it's difficult to have a conflict involving a group called "the Rebel Alliance" before there WAS a rebel Alliance. Resistance against the Empire does NOT mean it was the Galactic Civil War. Otherwise, the Clone Wars would also be folded into it. So, I agree with JSarek. QuentinGeorge 22:20, 6 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * As an analogy, most Western sources don't consider the Sino-Japanese War as part of WWII, even though it, unlike the situation here, DID involve combatants from WWII. QuentinGeorge 22:33, 6 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * It's odd though trying to understand your point, when Palpatine brought peace to the galaxy in 19 BBY with the end of the Clone Wars, and there were various uprisings and massacres between then and the formation of the Rebel Alliance. Wars don't happen until two opposing forces, and equally armed mind you, face off. -- Riffsyphon1024 23:45, 7 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * In fairness, the Rebel Alliance was never armed equally with the Empire. --SparqMan 06:23, 8 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * World War I also set the stage for World War II, and yet they're still considered two different wars, and rightly so. jSarek 05:43, 8 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * There's plenty wrong with the Wikipedia article, and I've tried to argue my point over there, but the article keeps being reverted. As JSarek said: WWI, the Depression and the Sino-Japanese war all "set the scene" for WWII, but aren't included as part of the war. If you want a SW example: consider that the Clone Wars didn't begin with the Battle of Naboo - even though the events of that battle are extricably tied to the Clone Wars. No, the CIS had to be formed first. Get it? QuentinGeorge 06:16, 8 Aug 2005 (UTC)

There's no such thing as X, Y, or Z BBY. Some people (including y'all) say that the Civil War began in 1 BBY with the formation of the Rebel Alliance, but others (including me) say that the war began with the Great Jedi Purge in 19 BBY during the rise of the Empire at the end of the Clone Wars. The debate over the start of the war has no end. -- Eddyward Telerionus 17:53, 10 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * They're called variables, John-1107. – Aidje talk 21:48, 10 Aug 2005 (UTC)

There are no variables in the Star Wars timeline, i already said that some like y'all said that the war began in 1 BBY with the rise of the Rebel Alliance while others like me said that the war started in 19 BBY with the Great Jedi Purge during the rise of the Galactic Empire. I repeat: the debate over the start of the war has no end, but i will end it in one way or another. -- Eddyward Telerionus 22:12, 11 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * Do you not understand what variables are? X, Y, Z can substitute for any numbers. -- Riffsyphon1024 22:23, 11 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * I partially understand the definition of variables, but i already said that's impossible for the Star Wars timeline to have any variables. -- Eddyward Telerionus 21:57, 12 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * Any timeline can have variables; all it means is "at some point in time". Have you not yet taken Algebra? – Aidje talk 22:51, 12 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * "the debate over the start of the war has no end, but i will end it in one way or another" - that's the logic we like to see. --SparqMan 23:22, 11 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * Sounds more like dictatorship than simple faulty logic to me. Even better. – Aidje talk 22:51, 12 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * Either the ROTS ICS or the VD said that "Palpatine would use Separatist holdouts and Rebel uprisings as excuses to keep his massive military force", in other words, the Rebels (being one faction of the GCW) did not appear until after ROTS and the Jedi Purge. The Purge itself was not a part of the GCW. VT-16 15:18, 24 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * Considering the fact that rebels can exist in multiple forms can you really know when the struggle shifted from a political resistance to military actions? Also, how do you determine which factions were members of the Alliance and which were just individual factions? Unless we get some new information on the time between ROTS and ANH I suggest that the start of the War be displayed as an indeterminable time. Use a range or something but seeing the information we have I would think it to be impossible to nail down an exact start. The Alliance is not a formal organization (at least not at the beginning) and therefore could not officially declare war. Just my opinion. --OompaLoompa of DOOM 23:58, 17 April 2006 (UTC)
 * The whole point of ROTS was the formation of the Empire and the beginning of the Rebellion. That's why there were characters like Bail Organa and Mon Mothma--characters that were still leading the Rebellion at the time of ANH, and also why Organa's ship was the Tantive IV among other things. The Galactic Civil War dates should be 19 BBY - 19 ABY. It's even easy to remember! There's a similar debate going on at the Rebellion Era discussion. The dates for these two should be the same, obviously. Right now GCW is 1 BBY - 19 ABY and RE is 0 BBY - 5 ABY, but this cuts out everything that is obviously rebellion--Kyle Katarn stealing Death Star Plans, etc. And The Rise of the Empire is said to end at O BBY. This doesn't make any sense; the Rise of the Empire ended when Palpatine made "The first Galactic Empire." Then the Rebellion--and the Civil War--began.

To much backstory-stuff
I realize that both Vader/Anakin and Luke and Leia are pivotal characters in the Civil War, but I think that their backsories should not be included here; they are available under the respective articles anyway. KEJ 11:22, 16 Nov 2005 (UTC)
 * A late reply but Yes, I agree. The article just sums up the movies. We need more backstory information concerning the war itself, like teh battles of X-wing, Battle of Turkana, Operation Strike Fear, Operation Skyhook, Admiral Thrawn etc. I propose the article should enter the category of 'we are doomed' MoffRebus 01:09, 8 Jan 2006 (UTC)
 * As a first action, expanded more the first feats of the Rebellion and I butchered the dark Trooper section. Sorry for it guys if you have spent time and effort on this. There are other places you can incorporate anything good you think that is missing about the DTs, like Dark Trooper, Dark Forces, Kyle Katarn. MoffRebus 03:21, 10 Jan 2006 (UTC)

Expanding

 * In answer to the request for expansion, perhaps we should enter a description of Galactic campaigns like in the Clone wars article?
 * I agree. It's silly that while the CW gets dozens of events mentioned and 100s of battles listed, the GCW gets three major battles and 10 or so briefly mentioned afterwards. There's the Kwymar Suppressions for one, a whole campaign against several systems in the Outer Rim. That's some while before Yavin, too. I think we need to go through this article, and any major 'war' article, for that matter. VT-16 19:14, 2 Dec 2005 (UTC)
 * I just added every battle I knew to the timeline. It's rather bigger now.
 * Just a quick comment: the main article references the liberation of Coruscant as being in the year 6 BBY. Surely that cannot be accurate?
 * What do you mean? It sounds accurate to me. That would be about 1 year after Endor. Rogue Squadron infiltrates the planet and brings down the shields.... I suppose it could've been 7 BBY, maybe, but 6 BBY seems pretty accurate to me. Mind specifying why you doubt it? Also, Coruscant was "liberated" 3 times I believe. Once in 6BBY when the Alliance took it from under Isard's small garrison, and again around 9BBY I think (my memory is pretty rusty hear so give or take a year or two)when the Imperials reclaimed it, and then the New Republic reclaimed it shortly afterwards. Maybe you were thinking of one of those?--OompaLoompa of DOOM 17:01, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

Improvement drive
I suggest we strive to complete these article quality-essential tasks:
 * Make it less detailed on very specific events (such as the whole dealio with Episode 4, which is extensively detialed here).
 * Move the timeline of events to Timeline of the Galactic Civil War.
 * Add sources. --Imp 19:37, 21 Dec 2005 (UTC)

What about including a bit more information about the campaigns of GA Thrawn and the Emperor Reborn? Right now, it's just glossed over and they were major events in the GCW. Ace Venom 22:07, 5 Jan 2006 (UTC)

Backward pic line up?

 * The first pics at the top are misarranged. Is this the same for every one?

Image
god, i hate the battlefront image. Jedi Dude
 * Deal with it. -- God
 * If you don't like it, propose another image. Otherwise, stop whining and follow God's advice http://img138.imageshack.us/img138/2086/tongue1ao.gif. --Sentry [ Talk ] 08:10, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
 * well nice the anon as some input..byt seriosuly what was wrong with the image before it? Jedi Dude