Talk:Darth Caedus/Archive2

Confused

 * I'm confused. What actually happening between Luke and Jacen. He's fallen to the darkside but i keep reading that Luke distrusts him, he was in the Jedi Temple and stuff like that. What happening? Jasca Ducato Sith Council (Sith campaign)[[Image:SOFD.PNG|20px]] 19:43, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

i'm confused how the GFFA would approve a sith at the leader of their secret police...


 * They don't know he's a Sith. --Sauron18 01:47, 4 September 2006 (UTC)
 * But Luke does.  Jaina Solo  Goddess Stuff [[Image:Jbig3.JPG |20px]] 00:28, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Luke doesn't know Jacen has expressed interest in becoming a Sith Lord, he only knows Jacen is starting to turn to the Dark Side. Big difference. QuentinGeorge 06:28, 11 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Sounds eerily familiar... hmmm, let me change around some names: "Obi-Wan doesn't know Anakin has expressed interest in becoming a Sith Lord, he only knows Anakin is starting to turn to the Dark Side." Oh, f*p! Holy crap! Oy! It's really scary... does anyone else here hear the "Imperial March" slowly creeping up on you? Adas Xendor 19:40, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

The Man Who Does/Doesn't Exist
I was wondering, why is there no place in this article for the Sith Jacen which keeps on flow walking around in Betrayal? --Sauron18 20:26, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Also, I was wondering if we had an article for Lumiya's illusions as well. I know "Sith Jacen" wasn't one of them, but still.--Sauron18 20:32, 16 September 2006 (UTC)

Where did this Quote Appear?
"Sometimes things must be broken in order to be rebuilt" - Jacen Solo

Where is it from? I think I might've read it and forgotten, but it is identical to one of Krayt's quotes, so I'm not sure if I read and forgot it, or if someone sneaked it in....--Sauron18 20:30, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Never mind, I found it --Sauron18 20:31, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Where is it from? I'd be interested to know.
 * It's from the Tempest excerpt in the Bloodines novel. Jaina Solo ( Goddess Stuff ) [[Image:Jaina_sig.jpg|25px]] 22:53, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Well, if they both said it... that is a very exciting link between the two. This may lend creedence to the Krayt is Jacen theory. - Breathesgelatin 03:25, 25 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Sorry guy, I been checking both the excerpt in Bloodlines and the novell Tempes itelf, this quote is nowere to be seen, from Jacen or anbody else. I remove it. --Petiflo 10:11, 3 December 2006 (UTC)
 * How can we trust you? You've only relied on excerpts from the novel and, apparently, a bad English dictionary. I'll replace it. Sir You Know My Name, N.K.-S.R.T. 20:56, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Jaina Solo said it was in the excerpt in Bloodlines but it sure isn't, and when this quote was added Tempest wasn't out yet, all we had was the excerpt in Bloodlines so if this quote is actually somewhere else in Tempest, how could anyone knew it at the time? Well, I'm willing to give it the benefit of the doubt because I'm not 100% sure. I will go through Tempest again to check. Anyway... How is my english relevant in this matter? I cannot be trusted because I don't speak -sorry, don't write- perfect english? How does that make sense? And how can you be trusted? Do you know where the quote appears? I bet you do since it seems you saw it in Tempest yourself (otherwise why would you claim it is?), just tell me the page then, I will see that I'm wrong and apologize. In the meantime I'm 90% sure this quote isn't in the book, but like I said, I'll check again, and if someone else could check too (you never know I can still say I didn't saw it but be lying about it can't I?) that would surely be very helpfull. --Petiflo 04:42, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

Rank?
Did Jacen become a Jedi Master before he fell? Or was he just a Knight? --Jedi Striker 18 September 2006, 23:41 (UTC)

As of the end of Bloodlines he remains a Knight, but there are calls to promote him. YIIMM 06:23, 19 September 2006 (UTC)


 * I was wondering cuz it says in Ben Skywalker's article that Jacen was his Jedi Master. If that's not the case, I'll make the change in Ben's article.  i just wanted to be sure. --Jedi Striker, 4:17, 01 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Well Jacen is not officially Ben's Master but into Ben's mind, he definetelly is. --Petiflo 14:01, 1 October 2006 (UTC)
 * It strikes me that everyone misspells "definitely". - Sikon 03:06, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
 * I think some of the confusion comes from the liner notes on the back cover of the Bloodlines novel. It says "Jacen, now a complete master of the Force, has his own plans to bring order to the galaxy." I think many confuse his mastery of the Force with him being a Jedi Master. Chervil 03:17, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Hmmm, could be we have another Jedi who assumed the rank of Jedi Master? Jedi Striker 16:27, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
 * No, he didn't. As far as he is concerned he is just a Knight and not so much eager to be a Master (to be more accurate he sees himself more like a Sith now, not even a Jedi). Ben alone sees Jacen as his "Master". --Petiflo 18:05, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Sith Lord succession box
Are we putting this back now that TOS has confirmed Jacen is getting a Sith name in Sacrifice?  StarNeptune Talk to me! 00:14, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
 * I say wait until he actually gets the name when the book comes out...  - breathesgelatin Talk 15:04, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Along with this idea, shouldn't we drop the Sith Character Info Box as well, until he becomes a full fledged Sith, he is still a member of the Jedi, and Galactic Republic at this point, just a thought  N.Y.N.E. Comlink[[Image:sithempire2.png|30px]] 04:47, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Is Jacen truly evil?

 * I'm curious as to people's opinions in this. Is he really acting for the greater good, or is he letting the dark side corrupt him so he only thinks he is? Up until he killed Ailyn Vel, I was sure he was still 'good', just doing what was needed, but after this, I'm starting to think he really will become totally dark. Do you think he'll come out good in the end...? Adas Xendor 16:25, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Sorry, talk pages are meant to discuss the article, not the article subject. For the latter, you may consider TFN. - Sixon 17:53, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes, Jacen has definitely done some pretty evil things, and is also on his way toward becoming a Sith Lord, which would, in my opinion, make him undeniably evil. But then again, like his grandfather Anakin, I can't necessarily see Jacen remaining evil. I must be the only one who thinks Lumiya/Vergere actually have a point... Greedo 15:00, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Both Lumiya and Vergere may have a point in terms of what they said about Darth Vectivus, but look at the things Jacen is doing. Adas Xendor 2:57, 20 October 2006 (UTC)
 * It comes down to utilitarianism; if his visions of the future are correct, his path is a tradeoff that probably is worth it (at least so far). Truly, what is the death of a few (even those close to him), the imposition of overstrict martial law, etc. compared to galaxy-wide chaos? Sure his acts may be evil in the sense that a Dungeons & Dragons detect evil spell would verify, but in this world it's much more grey. (For the record I am partially playing devil's advocate, but I really do like the addition of moral ambiguity and the twisting of Jacen's character to Star Wars.) Greedo 07:25, 21 October 2006 (UTC)
 * I totally agree, Greedo.....I'm actually shocked that someone besides me thinks that he's still basically on the right track. He's doing bad things, but he has to. DawnStrike 20:05, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
 * I'm not saying it isn't possible. But after having seen one character after another fall prey to the lies of the Sith, I'm just not holding out much hope.  My current vision of Jacen is of him becoming the next Vader.
 * He's doing bad things, but he has to...That's what Palpatine told Anakin and Luke. -- SFH 02:51, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Exactly. And as far as visions go, Anakin also had visions of Padmé dying, and as such, did what he thought he needed to do to save her.  In the end, he was the one who made the visions come true.  The same could possibly be said of what Jacen is doing; his attempt to save the galaxy may ultimately doom it. 69.26.85.90 03:54, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

To quote several million people: "He could be being harsh, to be kind." Darth Abeonis Sith Council (Sith Campaign) 12:46, 3 November 2006 (UTC)


 * I have to agree, he is taking the path of Anakin, but FOR GOODNESS' SAKE, if this is going to be Ep. 3 all over again, I WILL NEVER READ Star Wars literature again. Jacen deserves to have his own story, not his tacky grandfather's. DawnStrike9:58, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Believe me; originally, it would have been much tackier had the writers had their way. In Star By Star, Jacen was supposed to have died, and Anakin was taken in by Vergere. Eventually, Jacen's current story would have been Anakin's. EEEK! Sir Adas Xendor, Noble Knight of the Sith Round Table 05:51, 8 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Scary. .  .  .  .  06:47, 8 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes, Thefourdotelipsis; very scary. I'm glad GL put a stop to it. Sir Adas Xendor, Noble Knight of the Sith Round Table 01:09, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
 * That would have been the prequel trilogy all over again. Jaina Solo ( Goddess Stuff ) [[Image:Jainasolosig.gif |25px]] 01:17, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes, and I'm sure Lucas didn't want that. :P Sir Adas Xendor, Noble Knight of the Sith Round Table 00:37, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Well, at least LOTF is about Jacen learning from Anakin's mistakes, not repeating them. .  .  .  .  00:44, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Which, if the Legacy boys have their way, will be completely flushed down the crapper. Sir Adas Xendor, Noble Knight of the Sith Round Table 01:56, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
 * And I mean COMPLETELY FLUSHED DOWN THE CRAPPER. Responses, anyone? Sir Adas Xendor, Noble Knight of the Sith Round Table 19:02, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Anyone? Sir Adas Xendor, Noble Knight of the Sith Round Table 22:08, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
 * HELLO-O-O? Sir Adas Xendor, Noble Knight of the Sith Round Table 23:15, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
 * WHY HASN'T ANYONE RESPONDED?!?! Sir Adas Xendor, Noble Knight of the Sith Round Table 04:02, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Perhaps because talk pages are for discussing changes and edits to articles, not to discuss opinions about novels, storylines, etc. A better place for such discussion would be on a messageboard like theforce.net's forums.  - breathesgelatin Talk 07:38, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Because nobody cares? Greedo 21:45, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Maybe he's not truly evil, but he certainly is truly stupid. He should've just flow-walked (weeeee!) back a few more times until he got to Palpatine's "safe and secure" speech - lalala_la
 * I concur, but Lumiya brainwashed him into believeing the Dark Side could be the galaxy's salvation and that Palps was a fool (not disagreeing, just that he wouldn't put much faith into seeing Palps act a fool, and thus redeem himself. Tenel Ka and Allana will either save him or perhaps Tenel Ka may end up killing him, reference Dark Journey.) Darth Balls 16:58, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Well, that wouldn't be interesting. :( Sir You Know My Name, N.K.-S.R.T. 04:31, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

Krayt's master
Okay I have an idea. Could he be Krayt's master?

I dont think that he could be his master cause in tempest lumiya hints that she knows that there are other sith out there so it makes it sound like drath krayt's already around 69.26.85.156 22:54, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

Realy? I haven't read the series yet so I don't know what's going on.
 * Where did you here this? Sir You Know My Name, N.K.-S.R.T. 04:37, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes, there are more Sith around, as confirmed by Lumiya in Tempest. However, don't forget that LotF and Legacy are two separate products, and crossovers will likely be limited only to little mentions such as that, not using characters exclusive to either series. Besides, the Sith are already around, so why would Krayt need a Master? - \\Captain Kwenn// &mdash; Ahoy! 15:19, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Appearances

 * Troy Denning Confirmed that Jacen is going to be in Inferno so I am gong to go ahead and add it.Darth Solus 02:38, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
 * How do you know this? Are you Troy Denning? Sir You Know My Name, N.K.-S.R.T. 04:37, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
 * He said so in an interview.Darth Solus 00:33, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Which one? Are you sure'? Sir You Know My Name, N.K.-S.R.T. 00:49, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
 * I posted the link on the Inferno page.Darth Solus 15:13, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Lightsabre
As a Sith Lord, Jacen discarded his Jedi lightsaber and constructed a new, electrum lightsaber (probably with a red blade) to signifying his complete mastery of the force.

Is there a source for this statement, and i believe that (Probably with a red blade) should be removed. If the talk pages aren't for speculation the page itself certainly isn't.Darth Balls 00:54, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

There is nothing that says he gets an electrum lightsaber. However in Betrayal the future Jacen has black and gold robes and a black and gold lightsaber. I agree that the "probably with a red blade" should be removed.Darth Solus 04:39, 13 December 2006 (UTC)


 * In betrayal I don't recall a "future" Jacen I recall the Jacen that fought Luke, but at the same time there were both Luke and Ben's in this same form, it was a Dark Side illusion caused by Lumiya not a look at the future of any of these characters, but I could be wrong and will double check the book to make sure.  N.Y.N.E. Comlink[[Image:sithempire2.png|30px]] 04:56, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Well I'm re-re-re-re-re-re-re(etc)reading Betrayal, so when i get their i'll confirm your findings, still at Centerpoint.Darth Balls 16:07, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Chapter 35, it doesn't say anything about what "not-Jacen" is wearing, just whoever it was reeked of dark side energy, and his stare promised only malevolence. so i did some investigating that is a description of the false Luke... i'll remove it, see page 336 (hardcover), line 5-8. He was tall, slender, garbed in a traveler's robe of black and dark gold; it was stiled like a Jedi's but made out of expensive silks. A lightsaber, its hilt also in black and gold, swung at his belt.Darth Balls 18:27, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

That pasage doesnt describe the not luke it describes the sith lord vision that jacen meets. after jacen leaves lumyima talks to the vision and says jacen will eventually become you, another thing in the star wars universe gold is electrum i think that passage should be put back in

"Who put the thing about the electrum saber back in the article"-Darth Morder 15 December 2006
 * I did, should have been quite obvious if you looked through the history, but someone else added the bit about the synthetic red crystal. i need a citation for the color of the blade though.Darth Balls 01:04, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

"I dont think there is one in betrayal, although its almost certain to be red i agree it shouldnt be there without conformation".-Darth Morder 11:55, 16 december

"also The above passage about the figure in black and gold is definately not the dark Luke, I went through it last night, the sith lord says to jacen first you must go through my subordinates to get to me, then conjures the dark luke.

"This is getting stupid, someone obviously doesnt understand that being a sith lord doesnt always mean having a red lightsaber, If this is an unregisterd user i suppose there no way of finding out whos doing it I think were going to end up putting an edit shield round this article.-Darth Morder 12:45, 16 december

I'd say Jacen building an electrum lightsaber is fanon until he actually constructs it. The future Jacen from Betrayal is one path of many he could head down, and even then, the description from Betrayal doesn't specifically say it's electrum.Sailor Naboo

"It says a Lightsaber of black and gold, and in the star wars univere gold is electrum so its true".-Darth Morder 18 december


 * We only saw this saber on a Force Vision of a Sith Lord who doesn't exist yet. Even if in my opinion, it's likely that Jacen will have such a lightsaber, there is no solid evidence that he will. It is still unverified info to me. --Petiflo 01:43, 19 December 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree. The future is always in motion therefore we don't know how much of this vision is going to actually occur. Grunny (Talk) 03:28, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

"the vision is a reflection of jacens future, and besides the author of the book would not have gone into such detail about small things like attire and weaponary if it wasnt signifigent.-Darth Morder 19 december.

Never thought I could stir up such a war over one comment that I didn't read fully. Sorry mods, but can you put on a edit block and take off this non-sense about a lightsabre. We have no concrete proof that Jacen will do this, the future is allways in motion. Except when you get a statement and several ads with the title "Darth Who?", then we know Jacen will take a Sith name.


 * Like the argument over the Jedi Exile gender was not enough... now there's gonna be a new argument over Jacen and his lightsabre... Darth Morder you say the vision is a reflexion of Jacen's future, it's a reflexion of a possible future... Alright we all know he will become a Sith Lord and have a Darth title I can't argue on this, but that doesn't tell us anything about is lightsaber. What about the vision Luke had inside the cave in Dagobah... It was a reflexion of his future too at this time, did he ever wear a black armor at any time? I don't recall so. I'm not saying Jacen is not gonna have an electrum lighsaber, I'm saying we don't know what saber he will have. We just don't have any solid information at this time. And no, a Force Vision is not a solid information, "Always in motion is the future".--Petiflo 05:07, 20 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Can an admin please protect the page from anon edits to stop this being re-added repeatedly? --  I need a name  ( Complain here ) 13:22, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

Quote
"Sometimes, things must be broken in order to be rebuilt."

- Jacen Solo

Can someone confirm that's an actual quote from Tempest? Because Darth Krayt says that exact line in Star Wars Legacy 1: Broken, Part 1. It could be a user messing around with the "Jacen = Krayt?" thing, or a very interesting coincidence... - \\Captain Kwenn// &mdash; Ahoy! 16:15, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
 * While we're at the "did he say this" game, is this a confirmed quote from exile? My future is not preset; I have no special destiny! I forge my own way, I walk a new path. I shall determine my own destiny. Because Darth Krayt says ...I forge my own way, I walk a new path.... Though that seems more like coincidence than him re-iterating that 90-some years later.Darth Balls 19:28, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
 * This is already being discussed above on the "Where did this quote appear" section. --Petiflo 02:39, 18 December 2006 (UTC)
 * I'm resuming the debate here as this section is more recent. I've been through the entire Tempest novel, and I'm 100% positive that he never says "Sometimes, things must be broken in order to be rebuilt.", nor anything close to it. This is purely fanon.--Petiflo 11:03, 23 December 2006 (UTC)
 * I also had this doubt initially, as I pointed out above, but then I found it. I don't remember where, but I commented that I found it, so I must've (I don't really lie). So I'll look through my memory and try to find it, but I can assure you it wasn't in "Tempest", I remember at least that much. Something tells me it was in "Betrayal", but I'll have to check. --Sauron18 06:02, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

duel visions
RECENTLY, LEIA SAID SOMETHING TO THE EFFECT OF HAVING A VISION(VIA TATTOINE GHOST) THAT WAS OF A FIGURE SAYING "MINE" (I CANT CONFIRM,I HAVNT READ IT YET) BUT JACEN APPEARS TO HAVE A SIMILAR VISION WHILE CHILLIN ON THE "ANAKIN SOLO", AND DISREGARDES IT ... ANY THOUGHTS?
 * --dual visions--Recently, Leia said she had a vision of a figure saying "Mine", (I can not confirm this, because I have not read the book yet) then Jacen has a similar vision in Tempest while aboard the Anakin Solo. Discuss.Darth Balls 07:25, 6 January 2007 (UTC) edit by Darth Balls 22:01, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
 * sorry, but it was killing me and I can't edit your post, so i abbridged it in mine (sorry again). Otherwise yes, I noticed the similarities. I shouldn't think that there is too much (if any) of a connection between the two visions.Darth Balls 07:25, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

sorry bout that, im new to this... I wouldnt think much of it, except in tempest they both mention having the same vision.. i look forward to reading tattoine ghost just to see what her vision was all about

I don't know about Leia's vision, but Jacen does such a vision indeed in Tempest. And when I say Tempest, I mean the novell Tempest, not the excerpt from Exile. --Petiflo 10:18, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Also in Tempest I remember Leia thinking back to the vision she had in Tatooine Ghost at least I think it was that vision she was thinking about. Grunny (Talk) 05:44, 7 January 2007 (UTC)