Wookieepedia:Featured article nominations/Rakehell Squadron


 * ''The following discussion is preserved as an archive of a featured article nomination that was successful. Please do not modify it.

(6 Inqs/0 Users/6 Total)
Support
 * 1) I'm raking hell with the references! *Maniacal laughter*  Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 01:19, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
 * 2)  Chack Jadson  (Talk)  14:40, 30 March 2008 (UTC)
 * 3)  Greyman  http://images.wikia.com/central/images/9/9c/Jan.png ( Talk ) 19:32, 2 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 4) --  Darth Culator  (Talk) 00:05, 4 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 5)  Graestan ( Talk ) 22:19, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 6) Count it. Toprawa and Ralltiir 23:21, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Object
 * 1) From the Bridge of Chack Jadson:
 * 2) * "Instead, Skywalker stated that the immediate goals of the Jedi were to find a new location for their refuge; Celchu’s presence and eventual report would compromise their secrecy, recover the kidnapped Allana, the heir of the Hapes Cluster, who was being held prisoner as political and personal leverage over Hapan Queen Mother Tenel Ka, and to destroy Centerpoint Station with the aid of Joran Seyah to prevent its use by either the Confederation or Galactic Alliance." Confusing. I get what you’re trying to say but the part about Celchu interrupts the whole sentence.
 * 3) **Set off the Celchu part with a pair of dashes instead. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:07, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
 * 4) * "As Celchu could now justifiably say he was coerced if questioned by his superiors, he agreed to Skywalker’s plan, his long ties with many members of the Jedi Order, as well as Antilles, Solo, the Horns influencing his decision." Explain who the Horns are. I think you're missing an "and" too.
 * 5) **Got it, I think. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:07, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
 * 6) * "Following their successful mock pursuit of Reveille, Antilles directed Rakehell Squadron to commence a similar routine, this time on Broadside. However, this time they were opposed by Galactic Alliance starfighters, and not just any unit." Remove one of the “this times”.
 * 7) **Cleared up. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:07, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
 * 8) * "Even glancing shots intended to damage the Rogues were insufficient to stop the famous squadron and Rakehell casualties were mounting. Even as he fought and flew, Antilles noted that while at least two Rogues, including Rogue Leader, a Duros named Lensi, had been killed, the Rakehells had suffered losses of their own." Remove an "even". Also, "as he fought and flew" should be changed to another wording.
 * 9) **Changed. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:07, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
 * 10) * "With Celchu having returned to the Galactic Alliance, Rakehells had only eight pilots remaining in the engagement zone." Should it be “the Rakehells”?
 * 11) **Yes, it should, and now it is. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:07, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
 * 12) * "Just before they left, the Rakehells observed the detonation of Centerpoint Station, which obliterated both the Corellian/Commenori fleets and the Galactic Alliance flotilla, aside from the ‘’Anakin Solo’’, and brought the battle to an abrupt halt. Italicize the Anakin Solo.
 * 13) **Oops. Carryover from a cut and paste. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:07, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
 * 14) * "Cheriss ke Hanadi was a female Adumari whom Wedge Antilles met during the New Republic’s inaugural diplomatic mission to Adumar." When was this mission?
 * 15) **Tidbit added. 13 ABY. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:07, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
 * 16) *Nice article.  Chack Jadson  (Talk) 14:21, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
 * 17) Image objections:
 * 18) * Image:WedgeAntilles.jpg: There's some sort of checkered distortion covering the entire picture.
 * Image:Corran tfp.jpg: Distorted.
 * Image:JainaTahiri.jpg: Distorted.
 * Image:Zekk(2).jpg: Needs a crop. Also, it contains massive .jpg artifacts.
 * --Imperialles 12:58, 2 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Unsourced image. -- AdmirableAckbar (Talk) 21:13, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 1) *Image swapped for a IU more recent image of Wedge. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 2) **Okay. Something else: the images in the "Members" section aren't easy on my eyes. Could you have a go at shifting them to make it look nicer? -- AdmirableAckbar (Talk) 20:33, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 3) From the squalid cubicle of Graestan:
 * 4) * The intro needs a lot of context. Even as a mere summary, it would read as techno-jargon to all but the most EU-savvy of readers. People need to be set up, as do places, ships, etc.
 * 5) **More context added. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 6) * Honestly, a concerted effort to do that with the rest of the article would be nice. I am leaning to the side of "we should assume the reader has basic SW, but not basic EU, knowledge." Let me know. I plan to go over it in a little more detail soon, but would like some of this done first.
 * 7) * Graestan ( Talk ) 02:46, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 8) **Added a dash more context. Let me know what you think. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 9) Toprawa:
 * 10) * This likely has to do with my never reading many of these sources, but I didn't quite understand at first the difference between the NJO and the GA, in respect to your saying in the intro that Tycho's responsibilities were still bound to the GA. Maybe you could add something somewhere to say the fighter squadron was independent from the GA.
 * 11) **I think the added context in the intro has helped that problem. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 12) * This sentence is way too overdone/drawn out/run-onish. Please break up/reword: "Rakehell Squadron flew in the Jedi attack on Centerpoint Station and the Imperial-class Star Destroyer Anakin Solo, chasing the shuttle Reveille to the Anakin Solo as cover for a Jedi infiltration team attempting to rescue the Chume'da Allana, drawing off enemy fighters, and providing cover for the infiltration of a Jedi strike team onto Centerpoint Station aboard Broadside."
 * 13) **Cut in half. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 14) * Please provide a little context to this to explain what the Broadside is. And, please add  "the" Broadside if appropriate. If so, you'll need to do this in the body as well. You already have one main body instance of calling it "the Broadside," to please find consistency: "of a Jedi strike team onto Centerpoint Station aboard Broadside"
 * 15) **Not appropriate. Allston tends to call it Broadside IIRC. I've hunted down the one instance of "the Broadside." Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 16) * See, this, again, is due to my not reading this I'm sure, but I can't begin to understand how Luke Skywalker is apparently fighting against Rogue Squadron here. It would probably serve you well to briefly explain where the lines of battle of drawn earlier in your intro: "The squadron proved very effective in battle, managing to shoot down two members of the elite Rogue Squadron"
 * 17) **Again, added context in the intro should have explained this. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 18) ***Very nice job. Intro is much more clearer for "casual readers" like myself. ;) Toprawa and Ralltiir 17:42, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 19) * Your previous explanation, I feel, doesn't do enough to clearly state that she wants the Jedi to get involved, as I'm understanding this. Please clarify what this request is to solidify: "Celchu discussed Niathal's request with Jedi Master Luke Skywalker, phrasing his request in such a way that Niathal's involvement could not be traced back to her if he was betrayed"
 * 20) **Clarified and added context, I think. Let me know if it's not clear. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 21) * Additionally, you've got some clausal disagreement here. "...phrasing his request" implies you are referring to Niathal, when this is not the case. Please reword and also avoid using "request" as you are in two subsequent clauses: "phrasing his request in such a way that Niathal's involvement"
 * 22) **I believe I've cleaned that up. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 23) * Please either provide a similar descriptor for Syal or swap the order in which you mention them: "accompanied by his aides, scientist Toval Seyah and Syal Antilles,"
 * 24) **How silly of me. Descriptive adjectives inserted. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 25) * The end of this clause is just worded awkwardly. Please reword: "on the grounds that he refused to place the Jedi subject to Jacen Solo."
 * 26) **That's intentional. That's very close to what Skywalker says in Fury, and so that's how I worded it. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 27) ***Very well. Toprawa and Ralltiir 18:23, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 28) * You seem to imply here that Celchu wanted to help, but was bound by his GA duties. This doesn't quite match what you have in the previous sentence saying he was displeased at the very least. Please clarify a bit: "As Celchu could now justifiably say he was coerced if questioned by his superiors"
 * 29) **Clarified. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 30) * Please add a little bit here to better explain, as I'm understanding, this was a ruse to chase him into the hangar: "Skywalker planned to have Antilles raise a squadron of starfighters to chase Celchu's shuttle into the Anakin Solo"
 * 31) **Phrase added.
 * 32) * Please specify and link here what class of Star Destroyer this was. IIRC, it was an Imp-I. And, while you're at it, specify what the Anakin Solo was in the intro and body, if we know: "was initially stationed on the pleasure ship and converted Imperial-class Star Destroyer Errant Venture"
 * 33) **Not known. I ran a check of all LotF books post Tempest and the class is not given. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 34) * I believe you're trying to say they were all disguised, but this isn't worded correctly: "and Doctor Seyah, disguised as a Galactic Alliance Guard troopers"
 * 35) **How silly of me. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 36) * This is kind of a random descriptor drop here. Please clarify upon its first mention earlier in the article that Centerpoint is a superweapon: "to Centerpoint Station for their attempt to destroy the superweapon"
 * 37) **Intro context is done. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 38) * Same with the Broadside deal here. You alternate between calling the Reveille "the" and not using "the" throughout the body. Figure it out for consistency. These are just lazy errors, Ataru. Get tough.
 * 39) * If you're going to call them by their nickname here, you should do so consistently throughout the article. Pick one and stick with it, please. I would recommend sticking with "Rakehells" for formality: "The Rakes went defensive"
 * 40) **That's fine, but I still want to establish in that one mention that they did possess the nickname, for the sake of th quotes. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 41) ***Perfectly acceptable. If you haven't done so, you can put "known colloquially as the Rakes" upon its first mention in the article, or something along those lines. Toprawa and Ralltiir 22:07, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 42) * Since you never really establish Wedge Antilles as "Antilles" in this article, please specify who are you a referring to here: "In the midst of battle, Antilles noted that while at least two Rogues,"
 * 43) **I think I clarified this. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 44) ***After your addition, the "senior" part is kind of unnecessary, I feel. Feel free to remove that. Toprawa and Ralltiir 22:07, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 45) * Please explain who these people are. Identifying them along with their Rake callsigns would suffice: "Twool had been killed and Cheriss ke Hanadi was either dead or extravehicular, and Sanola Ti had also sustained damage"
 * 46) **Got it, but I think it looks silly.. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 47) ***Necessary descriptors, I feel. Toprawa and Ralltiir 22:07, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 48) * Run-on sentence here. Too many successive and's: "Twool had been killed and Cheriss ke Hanadi was either dead or extravehicular, and Sanola Ti had also sustained damage to her starfighter and Antilles ordered her to withdraw from the engagement zone."
 * 49) **Split. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 50) * The way this is worded just kind of bugs me. It doesn't read well. Could you reword it to avoid the backslash and choose a better term than "aside"? If you're enumerating losses here, "as well" would do better: "which obliterated both the Corellian/Commenori fleets and the Galactic Alliance flotilla"
 * 51) **Reworded. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 52) * This doesn't sound right. "That era" is too restrictive. Twelve-man squadrons were always common, AFAIK. Certainly, at least, dating back to the GCW: "As were most standard starfighter squadrons of that era,"
 * 53) **I'm not referring to the OOU era of Legacy, but the period of time during which members such as Luke Skywalker and Antilles flew. If you have suggestions on re-wording, let me know.  Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 54) ***I see what you mean. Don't consider this an objection, but you might add a little bit to somehow specify exactly what time frame, era, you are referring to. Maybe somehow specifying in the ABY years? Up to you. Toprawa and Ralltiir 22:18, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 55) * Just a reminder: be sure to put your punctuation before references. Get tough on lazy errors, Ataru.
 * 56) **I told you I wrote this fast. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 57) * Clausal disagreement. "Their" does not correspond with Wedge. Please rectify: "By slaving their communications equipment to his until any warning Celchu or the younger Antilles provided would be belated, Wedge Antilles"
 * 58) **I think it reads poorly now, but suggestion implemented nevertheless. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 59) ***You're right, and it wasn't clausal disagreement. I read that wrong the first time through. Antilles is doing the action, so it's fine. I've changed it back. Toprawa and Ralltiir 22:18, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 60) * You just started out the previous section with this exact wording. After reading these both, I would suggest removing this from the "Equipment" section. At any rate, please reword/remove one: "The members of Rakehell Squadron came from many different backgrounds."
 * 61) **Axed the first one. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 62) * Using "relative" as you do twice here is just kind of silly. Please reword: "her relative's skill in a starfighter, despite her relative"
 * 63) **That was extremely silly of me. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 64) * Please, oh, please, Ataru, avoid the "Her fate is unknown" statements. I've removed these for you.
 * 65) **I've never had a problem with them before, but I'll avoid them in the future. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 66) * Please don't speculate what may have happened here. Write what you know: "As of the Battle of Centerpoint Station, ke Hanadi was either dead or forced to go extravehicular during a dogfight with Rogue Squadron."
 * 67) **That's what Antilles says, so that is what we know. I'm not sure what you mean. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)\
 * 68) ***If he, i.e. the source, provides this speculation, then it is ok to use. Otherwise, it would be extrapolation. Fine to keep. Toprawa and Ralltiir 22:18, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 69) * Also, after looking back over the infobox, I understand why you've ordered the pilots as you did, but unless you specify in the infobox their Rake callsigns, please consider listing them in alphabetical order. Toprawa and Ralltiir 05:57, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 70) **Um . . . I suppose I can put them in the infobox, but it'll clutter it up some. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 20:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 71) ***Agreed it looks bad now. They should be listed alphabetically. Toprawa and Ralltiir 22:18, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Comments
 * Approved by Inquisitorius 23:21, 17 April 2008 (UTC) 
 * Ataru says:
 * WARNING! Fury spoilers, and more!
 * Yes, it is a single source nom. Don't let all those refs fool you.
 * I anticipate lots of objections, as this was written kind of fast and loose, but some of the things are intentional.
 * I know there's not much BTS info. I've e-mailed Source A for more, but no telling when I'll get a response.
 * First squadron article up for FA, so be wary of citing other precedents. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 01:19, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
 * I didn't think it was possible to have that many refs for a single-source FA.  Chack Jadson  (Talk) 01:54, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Kriff, this is what happens when I don't copyedit it at all before I post. Anyway, I'll try and address these tomorrow, but-I refuse to write a treatise on the developments of the Confederation-Galactic Alliance War prior to the Battle of Centerpoint Station. Our squadron/organization articles should have context, but not in-depth descriptions of conflicts in which they weren't involved. If there's a differing opinion on that, we should probably talk it out and come to a mutually satisfactory agreement in IRC. Atarumaster88  [[Image:Jedi_Order.svg|20px]] ( Talk page ) 06:45, 15 April 2008 (UTC)