Talk:Satele Shan

Origin Speculation

Looking over the recent edits and reverts, I wonder whether the article should not have some text regarding Satele's origin. I can understand the need to have only confirmed information and fighting against possible fanon. However should we not introduce the possibility of speculation? PointGiven 19:32, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

• We generally discourage speculation here. Chack Jadson ^(Talk) 20:16, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

Is it confirmed anywhere that Satele is a direct descendant of Bastila? I've seen nothing to that point as of yet. On the topic of speculation, though, it's compelling to wonder about who Bastila has children with, especially with Revan canonically male...Blackhawk003 06:25, 12 April 2009 (UTC)

• Actually, no one has claimed that Satele is a direct descendant, just that she is a descendant. In the web comic, Zym says "Regardless of her heritage..." and Dar'nala says "She does have the gift Master Zym, just like Bastila did." I think this is enough for us to be able to say that she is descended from Bastila Shan. Cylka^-talk- 08:19, 12 April 2009 (UTC)

Is it confirmed her surname is Shan? Being a descendant of Bastila doesn't mean that... in fact it kind of makes it less likely since usually the child of Bastila will hold the surname of the father.124.169.62.192 05:18, 14 April 2009 (UTC)

• She's called it in the comic, yes. - Lord Hydronium 05:20, 14 April 2009 (UTC)
• This is not enough evidence to say that she was directly descended from Bastila. Who says Bastila never had siblings? No one. We can say she is a descendant but not directly. --Redemption^(Talk) 00:55, 16 April 2009 (UTC)
  • There's no such thing as an "indirect descendant". Descent is by definition a direct thing. - Lord Hydronium 03:28, 17 April 2009 (UTC)
    • It would appear as you were right through a quick definition search of "descendant". Damn. --Redemption^(Talk) 03:41, 17 April 2009 (UTC)
• It's not definite that Shan would only come from a male sibling. If the father left the family or died early, Bastila could have decided to change the child's last name to Shan PointGiven 00:35, 22 April 2009 (UTC)
  • How did they keep the last name Shan in the family for 300 years? I mean it is possible, but very unlikely. TrandoshanMan01 14:32, 2 May 2009 (UTC)
• Do you think Revan was responsible for this? There's no other way Bastila could've had a great-great-great-great-great etc. granddaughter. Or could it be that Bastila had a brother or cousin with the same surname? 68.9.34.132 13:28, 23 May 2009 (UTC)
• I honestly think that the fact that she needs to be noted as a relative of some kind to Bastila, if not a direct descendant, although I am more inclined to believe the second, but not necessarily put it into the article.. If she were the great-great-great-great-great niece of Bastila or something, it would perhaps be noted but not emphasized as it is. Anyways, I think the father could be Carth, as she was not pregnant or didn't have a kid (as far as we know) in KotOR II, but it's possible that this is a new concept and they will just say that she hid the kid or something. Revan is still possible as Bastila is a woman and Revan has no confirmed surname, so Bastila's surname of Shan name would still be used for the child. This is further supported by the fact that Baras remarked that Angral's actions against the Supreme Chancellor nearly got him killed, and the only person in the room making any effort to destroy the Sith was Satele. Bastila and Satele also have very similar phenotypical features. At this point, I would write that she is a relative in of Bastila in the main article, as that is almost certainly undeniable, but I would not say for 100% certain that, at this point of time, we can conclude that she is a direct descendant. I would only say about 90%, and we need absolute certainty. 18:31, 5 June 2009 (UTC)Cjh37

I know that it needs to be confirmed, but if you were a developer would you make her descended from Bastila or say Billy Bob Shan?--Beleron 03:49, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

• All I know is that if Satele is a descendant of Bastila, the creators of TOR better make it so she is Revan's descendant as well. If Bastila had a kid with anyone else, I think a lot of fans would be pretty upset.

Why does there have to be a father? Its not like we havnt seen that kind of birth in the star wars universe before... Jlryan 08:20, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

She has not been confirmed to be the descendant of Bastila yet. It must be explicitly stated before we can say that and all that has been released is that she's a descendant of one of the main characters of KotOR and that her last name is Shan. She could just as likely be the descendant of Canderous, Jolee, Saul, Malak, Revan, or any of the other main characters. Just because her last name is Shan does not auotmatically make her a descendant, it's the same with Deena Shan. NaruHina ^Talk 01:50, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

• Except in case with Deena Shan fans have asked Randy Stradley if she's related to Bastila and he said she's not. Here, we have Satele's surname being mentioned in context of "heritage to Bastila" and even game developers have said that we've met a descendant of a KOTOR main character in a comic. They said is not as a hint "hey, some of those guys is related to somebody from KOTOR!", they say it as given because any fan with one brain cell will make obvious connection from Satele to Bastila. And frankly, having a descendant of Ordo, Karath or Malak having a second name Bastila and being a member of the Jedi Order is a little strange, no? Especially given the line "Satele has a gift... just like Bastila did". We should really stop ignore the obvious. Mauser^Comlink 02:22, 31 August 2009 (UTC)
  • Regardless of Deena being confirmed as not a descendant, the point is that she couldn't be confirmed as one just because of her name. Saying that she has a talent for Battle meditation like Bastila did can simply be her comparing Satele to a famous Jedi Knight with the same circumstances. To be blunt, one of them having a descendant with the same surname is no stranger than the "Shan" name staying with the family for 300 years straight. Until it is blatantly stated that "Satele Shan is the descendant of Bastila Shan," we really shouldn't even post the bit about the speculative connection between the two. As well, it is not stated in that interview that she is Bastila's descendant either so you can't keep sourcing it to that. They may have said that Satele is the descendant of a KotOR main character, but nowehere does it say that it was Bastila in the article. NaruHina ^Talk 06:47, 31 August 2009 (UTC)
    • You keep denying a fact that is obvious to everyone else, you realize that? Mauser^Comlink 07:20, 31 August 2009 (UTC)
      • It's not "obvious" to everyone else. It's deemed "likely" by everyone else, actually including me, but until it is definitely confirmed, it's still speculation and therefore against the rules. NaruHina ^Talk 07:57, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

Peeps were guessing who the father was and how it couldnt be revan and that they would be mad if it was someone else. Was giving another option. Wasnt screaming "change the article" just was tossing in some food for nerd banter. Jlryan 08:02, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

• This page is for discussing changes or improvements to the article, not for speculating about who's the father. Your discussion is and was off-topic so please stop. Also, I started a new conversation, separate from yours, the bullet is only there out of habit. NaruHina ^Talk 08:14, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

dont be so anal Jlryan 09:19, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

• Don't be off-topic. Also, civility is a policy and you just broke that one too. Continued rule breaking can result in a ban from editing. NaruHina ^Talk 09:58, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

• I have to argue with NaruHina here, that the speculation that Satele is related to Bastila is just academic for now. I know that Deena Shan is not related to Bastila so why should Satele be. Just because they have the same surname is not a good enough argument, look at all the Star Wars movies. The surname Antilles is used three time for three different men who are not related and one of them (Wedge) isn't even from the same planet as the other two. Satele having the ability of battle meditation doesn't prove her relation to Bastila either, in 300 years there could easily be someone else with the ability. Granted with in 300 years two females with the same surname with said ability is unlikely but not impossible. I personally believe that she is kin to Bastila and that the child Bastila had was with Revan. I mean the message Bastila lift with T3-M4 didn't say when she recorded it and for all we know Revan left to fight the True Sith before Bastila found out she was carrying his child. She may have had the child by the time she meet with Carth after the Battle of Telos IV. Again I agree with NaruHina that we need all the facts before the article can say that Satele is Bastila's descendent. --JMasterWor 23:01, September 28, 2009 (UTC)

More Speculation...

As far as speculation goes, has it ever been mentioned in the comic that this "gift" is battle meditation? I know it would make sense for it to be so, but it hasn't ever been seen in use or mentioned further then the initial comment by her master.Bvdrunner 22:16, October 15, 2009 (UTC)

Bvdrunner is absolutley right, there is no mention of battle meditation in the webcomics it is only refered to as a "gift" and only once is it refered to at all. It does say that her "gift" is like Bastila's but it never gets specific as to what that "gift" is. --JMasterWor 13:27, October 16, 2009 (UTC)

Even More Speculation

• This is just some more of the seemingly endless specualtion. Could it be possible that she is a decendent of both Bastila and Revan? It's stated that it was a long time before Revan went looking for the "true sith" so could it be possible that Revan may have gotten Bastila pregnant in that time? After all at the end of the game they were madly in love with each other. jedi_master425 November 21, 2009

Yet MORE "speculation"

Okay guys, let's settle this here and stop reverting each other. This case is quickly getting really absurd. First we get a character Shan with the mention of Bastila regarding her heritage. Yet somehow we claim that her being Bastila's descendant is not confirmed, even though the developers mention the comic featuring a descendant of a KOTOR character. They probably think we should have at least half of a brain cell and be able to put two lines together. But now we have a direct line saying that she has the blood of Dath Revan and you still tell me it is not confirmed? Seriously, what the hell? It's a narrative after all, the character know things they talk about - what other confirmation do you need? Mauser^Comlink 17:03, February 12, 2010 (UTC)

• I don't know. To me, to add that she was a descendant of Revan is speculation. Baras says "If Darth Revan's blood flows through your veins, you belong with us. To me, that says the Sith are not sure whether or not she actually is a descendant of Revan.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 17:10, February 12, 2010 (UTC)
  • I completely agree that your reasoning that she is Bastila's decendant. However, Kasra is completely correct. Baras says "if" she is. Meaning even IU, it isn't confirmed. - JMAS ^{Hey, it's me!} 17:17, February 12, 2010 (UTC)
    • Well, to me it's clearly the scene reads "If you are who you are, then you have a destiny blah-blah-blah". Look at Satele's reaction - she doesn't sound a bit surprised by the statement (where is NOOOOOO!, anybody?), the fact is clearly known to her. You know, some day we'll get even more direct confirmation that we need, but until then I feel it is very stupid of us to ignore the clues the writer is deliberately getting us and pretend that nothing said in the comic actually matters. Mauser^Comlink 17:19, February 12, 2010 (UTC)