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The Barsen'thorEdit

  • Nominated by: QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 11:57, March 13, 2018 (UTC)
  • Nomination comments: Because I don't like leaving things unfinished.

(0 Inqs/3 Users/3 Total)

(Votes required: 3 Inqvote(s) required to reach minimum. Additional 1 user or 1 Inq vote required to pass.)

SupportEdit

Added it to Wookieepedia:WookieeProject The Old Republic's FAN section. Good work. Fan26 (Talk) 18:46, October 4, 2018 (UTC)
  1. Fan26 (Talk) 16:18, December 1, 2018 (UTC)
  2. Awesome work on the article. Tomotron Revanchist Sith (talk) 09:28, February 5, 2020 (UTC)
  3. Shayanomer (talk) 15:48, February 5, 2020 (UTC)

ObjectEdit

FanEdit
  • No clue how this made it almost seven months without any objections or support votes. But I digress. At the bottom of the page, under I believe either "Skills and Abilities" or "Personality and traits", the following appears: "In addition to speaking Galactic Basic Standard, the Barsen'thor was versed in many languages of the galaxy. He could understand Dosh,[2] Gand,[23] Binary,[30] Nikto[37] Jawaese,[42] Shyriiwook,[51] Sullustese, Selkath,[59] Rakata[75] Esh-kha[77] and Mandaba.[89] In addition, the Barsen'thor was a skilled pilot, successfully performing many flight missions for the Coruscant Aegis under the callsign "Guardian."[4]" Does the instance of him speaking Sullestese and Selkath occur in the same scenario, therefore both are sourced to ref 59? Fan26 (Talk) 02:16, October 4, 2018 (UTC)
    • Correct, those two languages are featured in the same mission, hence why they are grouped under a single ref. QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 06:19, October 4, 2018 (UTC)
  • "Around that time, a sickness known as the Dark Plague struck the Jedi Order once again, driving Jedi Masters across the galaxy insane" This might just be my feeling, but the way the sentence is phrased is like the Dark Plague was mentioned elsewhere in the article, though this is the first mention of it. Would you consider revising the sentence?
  • "The Jedi Master was still missing five years later when an alliance of various factions was formed against the Eternal Empire." Do you think the word "against" should link to Revolt against the Eternal Empire? Fan26 (Talk) 14:23, October 4, 2018 (UTC)
  • " The Children were unwitting deep-cover agents of the Empire who shared a Force connection with the leader of the Empire, the allegedly immortal Sith Emperor Vitiate himself. " I think "unwitting" should actually be "unwilling".
    • Unwitting: adj. Not knowing; unaware: an unwitting subject in an experiment. I think it better describes their position, don't you think? QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 16:35, October 4, 2018 (UTC)
      • Good point.
  • In the "Disappearance and Death" section, the tomb's caption reads "Barsen'thor's tomb on Chandrila". I think "The" should be added to the beginning of it, since it's a title and not a name. Fan26 (Talk) 14:51, October 4, 2018 (UTC)
    • Added. If you see such minor mistakes, you are more than welcome to fix them yourself. You don't have to ask the nominator's permission every time :) QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 16:35, October 4, 2018 (UTC)
    • That's good to know, thank you. Those were the last things I saw.Fan26 (Talk) 18:46, October 4, 2018 (UTC)
  • I realized that since the character was confirmed to be male, we know which voice it canonically has. Would it be possible to get audio for the quotes where 'he' speaks? Fan26 (Talk) 16:46, November 29, 2018 (UTC)
    • I'll see what I can do, though having audio files is not a requirement for status articles, merely a recommendation. QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 09:12, November 30, 2018 (UTC)
      • I'm aware, it was just an afterthought. I'm going ahead and striking this-no reason to hold up the nom with this one thing. Fan26 (Talk) 16:17, December 1, 2018 (UTC)
Ecks DeeEdit
  • The LG places {{otheruses}} above any header templates.
  • I understand you want to avoid repetition and vary between usages of Barsen'thor/the Jedi/the Consular, but it gets somewhat confusing in some parts of the intro as I'm not 100% sure to what something is referring. Example: "Learning an ancient Force ability called the shielding technique from the Noetikon devices, the Jedi traveled from planet to planet, using the technique to sever the sick Jedi Masters from the influence of Lord Vivicar, the Sith mastermind behind the plague." Seeing as you talk about Jedi Masters in the previous sentence, it's not inconceivable that "the Jedi traveled" refers to the Masters rather Barsen'thor.
    • Made some adjustments. Please take another look. QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 08:27, October 8, 2018 (UTC)
  • "the Barsen'thor participated in the fight against the Children of the Emperor." Is there/should there be an article for this particular fight/crisis/whatever?
  • "The Children were unwitting deep-cover agents of the Empire who shared a Force connection with the leader of the Empire, the allegedly immortal Sith Emperor Vitiate himself. The Children had infiltrated deep within the ranks of the Republic, their presence masked by the power of the mysterious First Son." I feel like dedicating two whole sentences to context is a bit excessive when it comes to the intro. See if you could condense this a bit. 1358 (Talk) 21:36, October 7, 2018 (UTC)
  • I made some further tweaks in the intro, particularly trimming some context I found excessive. Please have a look and see if that's okay.
  • "During the Battle of Corellia, the Consular discovered that the First Son was in fact a sleeper persona implanted inside Jedi Master Syo Bakarn" I feel like it's a bit misleading to link Sleep/Legends here, as sleeper agents don't really have anything to do with the act of sleeping.
    • I might have gotten a little carried away while trying to improve overall linking in the article. Removed. QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 07:54, October 11, 2018 (UTC)
  • Seeing as we know the exact dates for the resurgence of the Sith Empire and the Cold War, I think it'd be a good idea to put these in the early bio to establish some sort of timeframe for the reader.
  • Before I start with the rest of the bio, please keep the location of {{Main}} consistent. Right now it's below the quote template in some places and above in others. I don't think we have any policy on this, but personally I think it looks better placed above the quote template (think of it as a header template of sorts). 1358 (Talk) 19:13, October 9, 2018 (UTC)
  • Arrival: The paragraph that starts with "Par told the apprentice the information..." barely mentions the Barsen'thor and it feels like it's too much context. See if you can trim it some. 1358 (Talk) 17:59, December 8, 2018 (UTC)
    • Reworded to focus a bit more on the Barsen'thor. I don't think that the context in this paragraph can be completely cut, though. It's all kinda necessary, IMO. QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 19:54, December 15, 2018 (UTC)
  • Defending the Forge: "the Consular deeply concentrated and used the machine to create a working lightsaber. Upon creating the lightsaber, he barely had time to test it before Raloch appeared" This feels a bit redundant, with the double mention of the lightsaber creation in close succession. 1358 (Talk) 19:47, April 26, 2019 (UTC)
  • Into the Black Sun's den: "Black Sun, a local criminal gang, had turned the cantina's back rooms into some sort of secret warehouse." This sentence is purely context and as such it feels a bit disconnected to the rest of the prose. See if you can integrate it better somehow.
    • Done.
  • Into the Black Sun's den: "wherein they met a Human Doctor called Maer." Why are we capitalizing "doctor" here? It's fine in the next sentence if the source material calls him "the Doctor", but in this sentence, I see no reason to capitalize it.
    • No, the source material does not specifically call him the Doctor, so I've decapitalized it.
  • Into the Black Sun's den: The paragraph that starts with "According to one of the patients" doesn't mention the subject of this article once. Please cut down on the excessive context. 1358 (Talk) 11:18, July 19, 2019 (UTC)
    • Cut down on some of the extraneous details. Please take a look. QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 18:21, July 27, 2019 (UTC)
      • It still feels a bit excessive, to be honest. You have three consecutive sentences that are purely context. See if you can cut down even more and maybe merge the paragraph with the following one.
  • Learning the ritual: "The sickness had been encountered by the Jedi Order before only once." This sentence feels a bit abrupt and detached, see if you can somehow integrate it better with the rest of the paragraph; maybe merge it with the next sentence, which also has just one clause.
  • Learning the ritual: Before I go ahead and finish reviewing this section (and article), please go through it and cut down on some of the excessive context. In the first paragraph of this section, you have eight consecutive sentences before the article subject is mentioned once. This is a recurring issue in the article (as evidenced by my review), so you might want to go through the entire thing and see if you can trim excessive context. 1358 (Talk) 20:52, August 9, 2019 (UTC)
    • I've trimmed the unnecessary details throughout the bio. Everything left is necessary context, IMO, so I'd like to approach the rest on a case-by-case basis if you feel there are still extraneous info. QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 15:17, August 18, 2019 (UTC)
ImpEdit
  • Would it be possible to obtain more images? Some of the sections and subsections can look pretty intimidating for the reader. If further subsectioning is possible, that would help, too. Imperators II(Talk) 12:35, May 18, 2019 (UTC)
    • I've done some splitting of some of the larger sections, while adding a few images here and there. Please take another look. QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 12:39, May 30, 2019 (UTC)
  • Is it not possible to utilize {{TORcite}} in refs 105 and 107, as well? Imperators II(Talk) 10:53, June 1, 2019 (UTC)
  • Ref 13: You're using the ref to source the date 3643 BBY for the Jedi Consular class, but the ref itself actually only dates the Jedi Knight, Smuggler, and Trooper classes to that year. Either the reference should be expanded to a manual ref note, or perhaps the dating template itself needs to be amended. And I'm not seeing why ref 13 is used upon its second instance in the article. Imperators II(Talk) 14:29, June 12, 2019 (UTC)
    • Took me a while to figure out how to tackle this, but I think I've figured out a way to reword/expand this. Hopefully, it's not too convoluted. QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 09:58, June 19, 2019 (UTC)
  • "Gaining a trusted ally" — the quote's missing some punctuation. Is the omission coming from the source? Imperators II(Talk) 16:23, January 5, 2020 (UTC)
    • No, it's coming from my own derpiness. Fixed. QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 16:49, January 6, 2020 (UTC)
ShayanomerEdit
  • Article says he died. Is there a reason why the infobox is missing this information? Shayanomer (talk) 11:15, February 4, 2020 (UTC)
    • Based on current sources, we can only estimate his death date to have occured at some point between 3638 BBY (last confirmed appearance in Shadow of Revan) and 14 ABY (confirmed to be dead by that point due to the appearance of his tomb in Jedi Academy). To say that a character died at some point during an almost 4000 year-long period is just stating obvious information and is in no way useful to the reader. QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 12:34, February 4, 2020 (UTC)
  • Same thing for his birth. A rough date would be appreciated. Shayanomer (talk) 12:06, February 4, 2020 (UTC)
    • Since we do not know how old the character is at the start of SWTOR's class story, best I can do regarding the birth date is "some years before 3643 BBY" or somesuch. And I'm also reluctant to add this, to be honest. If we first encounter a character in a story set in 3 ABY, obviously that character had to have been born at some point before 3 ABY. We don't have to state the obvious. QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 12:34, February 4, 2020 (UTC)
      • Very well. I was only curious since I'm totally not familiar with TOR, as are many readers. Shayanomer (talk) 12:37, February 4, 2020 (UTC)
  • Is it possible to use a "canon" appearance for the infobox image? Shayanomer (talk) 12:49, February 4, 2020 (UTC)
    • There is no confirmed canon appearance, as the in-game avatar is customizable by the player. Even though the gender has been confirmed in a FFG book, there's still a ton of variations in terms of species and visual appearance. Images such as this are merely promotional images orbitrarily chosen to illustrate the character. QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 12:59, February 4, 2020 (UTC)
Helping the TeralEdit
  • "The Jedi asked to be made the House's delegate, but there were complications to that." This can be reworded better.
    • Reworded.
  • "They planned to form an alliance with the Organa through a marriage..." Is "the Organa" actually referring to House Organa? A little confusing here. Shayanomer (talk) 13:49, February 4, 2020 (UTC)
    • Yes, it was referring to the House. I've clarified that. QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 08:57, February 5, 2020 (UTC)
Battle with the plaguemasterEdit
  • "In fact, Vivicar was merely a vessel for the spirit of Morrhage..." A better sentence opener can be used here.
    • Reworded.
  • "...a rare and distinguished title that only two Jedi had held in the millennia before." Would be good to specify who the two Jedi are in the paragraph. Shayanomer (talk) 15:00, February 4, 2020 (UTC)
Revelation on QueshEdit
  • "Determined to rescue the scientists, Nadia unexpectedly for the Consular demonstrated that she was in fact Force-sensitive,..." Grammatical error here.
Restoring troop moraleEdit
  • "The captain seemed to survive anything the Coalition Forces could throw at him and seemed invincible. In addition to that, Valon had recently stolen a thermal bore device that could crack Hoth's ice shelf and could potentially destroy the Republic base." Parts of this can be reworded more formally.
Blaesus exposedEdit
  • Third paragraph is missing a reference at the end. Shayanomer (talk) 15:26, February 4, 2020 (UTC)
Battling the Order of RevanEdit
  • The image in this section is moving the heading below. Try resizing it to alleviate this issue. Shayanomer (talk) 16:24, February 4, 2020 (UTC)
    • Moved the image, made it a bit smaller, and also evened out the length of paragraphs in this section. QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 13:20, February 5, 2020 (UTC)

CommentsEdit

  • Issues from the previous nomination have been addressed. Paragraph size has been significantly reduced, and some long sections have been split up. QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 11:57, March 13, 2018 (UTC)
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